Villa 1 – 4 Leicester; Beaten by a better side.

I don’t know what to say or think, to be honest.
Were we really that poor or is just that Leicester were very good?
I tend to think that Leicester looked the best, most complete side we’ve faced this season.
They work incredibly hard and close down very quickly.
Certainly many of our players looked frustrated, proving that their hard work was justified.

Somehow, we’re still not in the bottom three and we have some “easier” games coming up, so I’m not quite all doom and gloom, but it is somewhat worrying.

What I noticed more than anything today is how anonymous John McGinn looked again. It seems to me that he’s playing a lot deeper, probably under instruction from Dean Smith. If that is the case, it seems to me it’s taken an edge off his game and we would do well to get him more forward.

I don’t want to continue to slate Wesley, but I find myself continually thinking “How come we very often get the ball in the box, yet he never scores?”
Kienan Davis can’t get back quick enough for me, as while he might not be prolific, he is definitely a decent hold-up player. As soon as he’s match fit, he has to replace Wesley, in my opinion.

Even Jack’s game was off today, as the ball seemed to get stuck under his feet quite often and it summed things up, as I can’t think of a Villa player who merited a 7 out of 10, Tom Heaton apart.

We continue to give the ball away and Mings was guilty of this again, not long before he went off injured. I possibly shouldn’t say this, but even though he’s a bit of a talisman for us, a part of me would be glad if he misses a game or two, as maybe it’ll help him re-focus.

Simply put, our midfield got bossed and I think I was right in saying that this definitely wasn’t a game for Hourihane, as I think things would have been worse.
Their attack, particularly Vardy are a class above us and even their defence has excellent stats this season. I’m sure I heard they’ve only conceded 10 all season.
It’s probably not surprising that we lost, but it’s the scoreline that disappoints me.

Oh well, my hope now is that the players don’t lose heart and belief.
I still expect things to get better over the next few weeks.

54 Comments

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  1. GIDDYVILLAN2
    GIDDYVILLAN2 December 8, 2019 at 4:48 pm . Reply

    The remaining fixtures for December could become very telling as these could become 6 pointers this early in the season if you cant beat the teams below you which isn’t many alarm bells should be ringing.i think since Mings England call up he’s become error/lacklustre prone Mcginn haven’t a clue Wesley well I said over the summer one of the newbies will turn out to be a dud he gets my vote part of any strikers CV is scoring goals yes his hold up play isn’t bad but the knives are slowly coming out for him UTV

  2. Hitchens60
    Hitchens60 December 8, 2019 at 5:17 pm . Reply

    Good news is that Norwich and Southampton both lost today and we still have a significantly better goal difference than the bottom three.

    I agree with Badger (again 🙂 ) in that we have play McGinn more in the attacking third to get the best from him. I didn’t see today’s game but maybe (this and against Chelsea) it was more their attacking play forcing McGinn to play deeper rather than instructions from Smith.

    I’m still going to harp on about playing McGinn in an outright striker role at least until we can get someone in in January. He’s on record of saying he’d do it and I reckon he’d pose more threat than Wesley.

    Final word – I really don’t expect us to get anything at Sheffield United.

  3. GIDDYVILLAN2
    GIDDYVILLAN2 December 8, 2019 at 5:24 pm . Reply

    I’ve been sat on the fence with Wesley alot of people defend him ok it’s there opinion but I’ve now come to the conclusion I ain’t seeing the positives.We need to give him competition up front in January maybe that’ll spark some life into him but I still don’t think that’s going to improve him

  4. Villain1
    Villain1 December 8, 2019 at 5:37 pm . Reply

    Leicester clearly are light years ahead but there are some growing issues that should be of huge cause of concern to the board right now.
    Dean as much as I like him looks out of his depth – in game management has been sub standard, as has his selections at times (Elmo today as an example). The surrender of leads when the opposition should of been on the back foot has cost us at least 6 points – and we aren’t learning from it ( we continue to make only reactive rather than proactive subs).
    Wesley has been a monumental failure – and given the manager clearly has zero trust in Kodija we have no other options at present. Whether it was Dean or Suso that made the call, the striker situation is amateurish.
    Clearly we need to be rotating a bit – McGinn looks in dire need of a rest but plays every game, likewise Mings has been very poor recently and no sign of being dropped. Dean needs to stop this loyalty to certain players – if you dont perform you should be out the team. Successful sides are ruthless.
    Despite this we arent in the bottom 3 but Southampton are improving no doubt and I do believe the points total to stay up this season will be high as everyone (bar us and Watford) seems to be able to get wins against the traditional top 6 home and away. The next 5 games are crucial – if we are in the bottom 3 come January 2nd, I think we will begin to look odds on for the drop and Dean’s position will come into question.

  5. Tony Hill
    Tony Hill December 8, 2019 at 6:47 pm . Reply

    Very poor today, second best to everything yet again. Wesley needs dropping as does Mings regardless of injury. They couldn’t even raise their game in honour and tribute to the great Ron Saunders!

  6. Big Fat Ron
    Big Fat Ron December 8, 2019 at 7:53 pm . Reply

    Badger, I am concerned. All I have this evening are questions:
    Why are Sheffield United looking comfortable at this level but we’re not?
    Why are Steve Bruce’s Newcastle sitting comfortably in mid-table but we’re not?
    Why was Brendan Rodgers mentioned but not pursued last November?
    Why Wesley for £22 million when Jiminez cost 16? Or why not Danny Ings?
    Why is Mings still in the team?
    Why does Smith persevere with the same formation?
    Why not try a back 3 if if you cant keep a clean sheet and it works for Wolves and you have 5 centre backs on the books?
    Why has Lansbury disappeared after a magnificent game against Wolves in the cup featuring a through ball that McGinn would’ve been proud of?

    Is there a common answer?

  7. Big Fat Ron
    Big Fat Ron December 8, 2019 at 8:44 pm . Reply

    …why not Maupay?
    Why is Kodjia being paid?
    Why not try playing Wesley with a partner? Choose from: Jack, John, Conor, Anwar, or Jota. There are options! Change the f****** formation!

    No, I’m not a football coach, but here’s the logic.
    Defence is shit. Solution: reinforce defence with 5 at the back. See England World Cup 2018, Wolves, or Villa 1995/96
    Lone striker is shit and isolated. Solution: drop him OR give him someone to play off who can shoot and pass. See 5 options above. Is that so difficult?

    Smith has backed himself into a corner because he’s not reacted quick enough.Things that I and others have been saying for two months still haven’t been tried. If he doesn’t try something different and it goes sour at VP vs Southampton, there is a real danger of the crowd turning toxic. Sheffield away is a free bat because no one expects anything. 5 at the back and 2 up top! Oh, and why aren’t O’Kelly and Terry making these suggestions?

  8. Mark
    Mark December 8, 2019 at 10:07 pm . Reply

    I hate to say it but I think Tyrone Mings appeared to put himself before the team today by not coming off straight away when he got injured. He stayed on and was then hobbling in a failed attempt to chase Vardy for the first goal. Elmohamady is just not good enough at this level and was caught ball watching for goal number 3. Whilst I still think there are at least 3 other teams poorer than us, it is going to be a long season.I just hope that we give it a real good go in the cups (thanks to Paul Lambert for the quote).

  9. Bill Pearson
    Bill Pearson December 8, 2019 at 10:08 pm . Reply

    Problem Now Is The Team, I hope heads dont drop and reality steps in, we have to knuckle down and fight, its not over till the fat lady sing. January is the time to look at it and hopefully we strengthen that midfield striker problem .

  10. Hitchens60
    Hitchens60 December 8, 2019 at 10:50 pm . Reply

    The knives are out!

  11. Originallondonlion
    Originallondonlion December 9, 2019 at 12:59 am . Reply

    You must be able to assess honestly your own team’s strengths and weaknesses, and then be reasonably accurate about your opponents each week – who are different enough to require different tactics.

    Thumped twice by a 3 goal margin this season and frankly we employed the tactic better suited to playing City against Leicester and vice versa.

    City are best attacking opponents who want to camp 8 men in 2 banks of 4 and no wider than the 18 yard box. Because city have the close passing tricks to flick balls through the smallest gaps and sharpshooter forwards who can tuck the ball away from close range. Sterling apart – they are not particularly quick, nor are Chelsea, so playing high line gives you a fair chance of sprinting back to cover a breakaway.

    Leicester, with the exception of Maddison, struggle to break down tight defences. Their strength is being the fastest team on the break, and having the long ball passing accuracy to make that deadly, Spurs probably rank second at this tactic. Playing a high line is fatal against this type of team, our defence is faster than average but you would not back them to run down Vardy or Son.

    Our forward line isn’t quick, we rely on balls into the box from the wingers or full backs – but we have the glaring weakness of Wesley who cannot jump and head a ball with any power, so crosses in the air will not work. Crosses on the ground require to be met first time (there is no time to take a touch) with an accurate shot, and recently McGinn Trezuguet and El Ghazi have missed the target from golden chances.

    1. Hitchens60
      Hitchens60 December 9, 2019 at 1:15 am . Reply

      OLL – without taking issue with any of your observations; are you not supporting others on here that are questioning Smith’s experience and ability to deal with the tactics required to survive (be successful) in the EPL.

      I don’t think anyone would question the hard yards by Smith in learning his trade but the EPL is another level entirely and his ability to deal with the curve may well define his future.

      On that point; two observations spring to mind :-

      Chris Wilder at Sheff Utd. and
      Nigel Pearson at Watford.

      Should make for interesting ‘viewing’.

      1. Originallondonlion
        Originallondonlion December 9, 2019 at 2:37 pm . Reply

        Yes. Smith does not have Premier League managerial experience. That is not a flaw in itself. What matters is – now he is in the EPL – Smith learns from what better teams do to his selections and tactics. It is time he started Kodjia – even if he doubts him – by telling the player he does not think he will prove any more effective than Wesley but here is the chance to prove otherwise.

  12. Hitchens60
    Hitchens60 December 9, 2019 at 1:27 am . Reply

    Hopefully I’ve copied this link successfully. Sir Ron’s obituary which says everything about the man.

    https://www.facebook.com/AstonVillaTheInformer/videos/602078593933132/

    1. Hitchens60
      Hitchens60 December 9, 2019 at 1:30 am . Reply

      If not well worth going to The Informer, Aston Villa and watching the video Tribute to Ron Saunders.

      1. Hitchens60
        Hitchens60 December 9, 2019 at 1:30 am . Reply

        On Facebook

  13. nath
    nath December 9, 2019 at 5:09 pm . Reply

    game against foxes worried me. because they are great at counter attacking team. so the result did not come as a massive shock. it was a result i saw coming, if not by the emphatic scoreline.

    i thought we started brightly, but soon as we missed the sitter, el ghazi somehow hitting the bar when it was far easier to score. we were second best to the end. Leicester are second in the table, they showed why. far too street wise for us. fans been on wesleys back most of the season when to me its defence which they should be worried about.

    we are conceding too many from basic crosses, set pieces we also need to work on,doesn’t matter who scores our goals to me. we are conceding too many basic goals to win games.

    somebody further up posted about sheff utd and how they are coping better. well they were better than us last season imo. they have had most of their squad together for three seasons now, so much more settled and they all know their jobs / roles in the team. they are a good example of what can be achieved with patience. but even they will struggle at times in this league. their last game they struggled to break newcastle down.

    regarding villa we fans have a role to stick with the players and manager. nothing will be gained from adding to the increasing pressure on the team. they are a youngish team and most are first timers in the premiership. foxes exposed all our weaknesses in one game. apart from maybe this and wolves game, we have been in all the games barring them two.

    finally the games which we have coming up are most important games. sheff utd may have adjusted better than us in this league. but they can be beaten. newcastle beat them pretty easily. by simply packing a deep defence and breaking on sheff utd. who beat themselves by running out of ideas in the last third. getting desperate they opened up too much at the back. something which was our downfall against foxes.

  14. Holte66
    Holte66 December 9, 2019 at 6:17 pm . Reply

    Having calmed down and analysed Sunday’s game with the perspective of a Man Ure and Liverpool fan at work, the conclusion is we have lost the games we expected to so far this season, with the exception of Bournemouth and got points where we had hoped to mostly. We have had a really tough run of fixtures which hasn’t helped confidence and morale.
    The other thing that my work colleagues agreed on was Wesley, that he is a liability and contributes very little to the team. The Liverpool fans comments were that we might as well stick a wheelie bin up top as the ball just bounces off him. The argument that he doesn’t get much service doesn’t stack up because we do get the ball into the box but he never seems to be where it matters. El Ghazi and Trezeguet show more presence in the box than Wesley. Smith might as well use El Ghazi through the middle and play Jota.
    I’m not expecting anything from Saturdays game, so for me the real crunch fixtures follow that, with the most important January window we have ever had to follow. I’m hoping that we have everything lined up to get a striker in immediately. Waiting till the end of January could prove too costly.

    1. badger123
      badger123 December 10, 2019 at 12:12 am . Reply

      “we do get the ball into the box but he never seems to be where it matters.”

      This is the point I’ve been making.
      It’s all well and good being young and learning etc, but he’s consistently nowhere near where the ball goes.
      Hardly a sign of a natural striker and it’s why Davis has to come in asap.
      Even if he doesn’t score many, he’ll get the ball, hold it and pass it to involve others who are in the right places and seem far more natural strikers than Wesley.
      Which is nuts when you consider they’re wingers or mids.

  15. Big Fat Ron
    Big Fat Ron December 9, 2019 at 11:46 pm . Reply

    Rewind 4 months. Gary Cahill and Daniel Sturidge available on free transfers. FREE. But we wanted a young squad, which means zero PL nous. Back to present day. That lack of nous is painfully evident now.

    1. Hitchens60
      Hitchens60 December 10, 2019 at 12:10 am . Reply

      BFR – I’m with you on Cahill but not Sturidge.

      Our owners are businessmen always looking to protect their investment so buy young with potential upside value and IF we get relegated they can recoup part of their outlay with profits which, in turn, allows them to invest in the Championship. Luiz is a prime example with a guaranteed profit if Man C take up their option.

      I am hesitant to criticise Smith but there are those who feel he’s showing a lack of tactical nouse and a set of balls in making tough decisions!

      Wesley is the prime example BUT is Smith being forced to play him by his masters – after all they did splash out £22m on him – and probably don’t do ‘egg on the face’

      Don’t you love a conspiracy theory 🙂

      BUT on a serious note, I hope that Purslow isn’t interfering in team selection on instructions from on high?

      1. DSVilla
        DSVilla December 10, 2019 at 10:56 am . Reply

        I think the owners are too successful and experienced to be concerned about egg on the face. We are operating with 3 strikers. One can’t score, one is injured and the other one doesn’t want to be at the club.

        We are crying out for a decent striker in January. Most of us felt that way before the summer window closed. Missing out on Maupay was a disappointment, and I would have him ahead of any of our 3. i don’t know the FFP situation, but with the amount of money at stake I can’t see any chance of us not trying to fix this in January

  16. badger123
    badger123 December 10, 2019 at 12:26 am . Reply

    Cahill, with his wages?
    There’s a debate to be had that he has the nous, but it would have destroyed our pay structure and was never on, imo.
    Sturridge, just no, as much as I like him on his day.

    Maupay?
    Yes, even though he wasn’t Prem looks like he would have been a good buy for us, suiting the way we play.
    I reckon Smith was probably over-ruled on that one as someone thought Wesley was a better bet.
    Pitarch maybe????

    I doubt Purslow is interfering, myself.
    It doesn’t seem to be his style to me.
    Same as the owners.

    1. Big Fat Ron
      Big Fat Ron December 10, 2019 at 12:35 am . Reply

      Look at Palace’ s defence, Badger. Then look at ours. No other argument needed!

      1. Big Fat Ron
        Big Fat Ron December 10, 2019 at 12:37 am . Reply

        Look at Sturridges record and know-how. Now look at Wesley. Again, no other argument needed.

        1. Hitchens60
          Hitchens60 December 10, 2019 at 3:14 am . Reply

          No sell on value and high wages – which sort of answers the question over our owners investment strategy.

          1. Big Fat Ron
            Big Fat Ron December 10, 2019 at 7:20 pm . Reply

            Hitch, what’s Wesley’s sell on value at the moment? Will if go up anytime soon? Did the ‘sell on’ strategy work with Amavi, Traore, Veretout etc???? There is something badly flawed with this strategy if it’s a blanket rule. There’s nothing wrong with making one or two exceptions when top class, experienced professionals and serial winners with PL know-how become available. For short term gain, namely points on the board, a higher position in the table, and ultimately a more successful season to attract players in the next window, why is that a bad thing? Can’t anyone see beyond pound signs and investment these days???

            1. Hitchens60
              Hitchens60 December 10, 2019 at 9:32 pm . Reply

              BFR – I’m not suggesting for one moment that our owners aren’t winners and don’t want to win – of course they do otherwise they wouldn’t have provided funds in the summer.

              If you listen to Purslow though, there is a clearly defined approach to the players they want to buy.

              Neither am I defending it; I’m just raising it as a topic for debate.

            2. Hitchens60
              Hitchens60 December 10, 2019 at 9:37 pm . Reply

              Just to add ‘did it work with Amavi, Traore, Vertout – no but that’s because Villa, at that time, couldn’t organise a ‘piss up in a brewery’ :-). The value of all those players have risen beyond what Villa paid for them – and they’re all good players!

              I don’t want to see that again with our club all but completely bust.

              1. Big Fat Ron
                Big Fat Ron December 10, 2019 at 9:54 pm .

                Hitch, the reason it’s fundamentally flawed is that if you really want to win, you don’t sell your best players! And you certainly don’t buy them with profit as a priority. You sell them when you lose, when you can’t go further and they can. So the mindset is not that of a winner but a loser. A self-fulfilling prophesy if you like. ” Oh well, when we don’t win, at least our players will make us a tidy profit.” We’ve been there before and this policy leads to dismantling of good teams and eventual decline! Learner made tidy profits on some super players who were on the brink of CL football. It’s a complete nonsense and owners and fans are kidding themselves if they think it’s clever. Buy too class players to WIN. NOT as insurance policies when you lose! Winning will bring the profits! Selling players = losing!

        2. badger123
          badger123 December 10, 2019 at 6:51 pm . Reply

          BFR, Villa and Palace are totally different types of sides.

          Fair enough, they’re good defensively, but I’d suggest that’s more about the way they are set up and not just about Cahill.

          It’s no coincidence that only Watford have scored less goals than them.

          Granted, it’s fairly effective, but you pays your money and takes your choice, I guess.
          And that sort of setup will never be what Dean Smith’s about, imo.

          1. Big Fat Ron
            Big Fat Ron December 10, 2019 at 7:14 pm . Reply

            Palace play good football, Badger. They just don’t have the forward line that can get goals. They are defensively solid and that’s what good teams build off. We’re trying to build on quicksand with our defence. Something needs to change. It won’t be personnel so it has to be formation.

  17. Big Fat Ron
    Big Fat Ron December 10, 2019 at 12:34 am . Reply

    If there is interference in team selection, then the sun has already begun to set on our bright new dawn. I hope it’s just a case of Smith getting PL stage fright and he soon snaps out of it. Like I said before, atmosphere at VP could turn if things go wrong against Southampton. But if Smith changes formation and personnel, in my opinion, he buys himself some time, as at least he’s seen to be trying something different…

    The argument for business investment is weak. The ‘if we get relegated’ mind set is a loser’s mindset. The millions on Sturrigde’s wages would be better than 22 million for Wesley, assuming Sturrigde stayed fit. If we go down, they will make a loss on Wesley and Mings, not to mention God knows how much lost revenue from leaving the elite again, so the thinking is totally flawed!

    1. Hitchens60
      Hitchens60 December 10, 2019 at 3:10 am . Reply

      Maybe you’re right BFR but I still venture to suggest there is a balance between investing for a future in the EPL and defensive thinking in the event we go down.

      Being realistic the owners backed a two year promotion plan which looked sensible ‘till we pulled off the (nearly) impossible. The odds (and history) on us surviving the EPL are stacked against us.

      Personally I have no issue in the way in which the owners have backed us and the young and future value approach. We’re not in a good place in the EPL table but we’re in an excellent position financially – that has to be good for the medium to long term future.

      Sorry if that sounds negative – not meant to be.

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