First off, I want to apologise for my rant on the previous thread.
I wrote the article simply because there was little to talk about and wanted to create some debate. It was simply a bad idea.
I’m on holiday and as you do, had had too many beers, leaving me in an overly-argumentative mood.
Looking back, I think it backfired on me big time, as it led to me saying things I didn’t really mean.
Particularly regarding Hourihane, who, although I still see him as lightweight at times, definitely brings value to the side.
I totally agree, his goals and assists speak for themselves and as long as he’s part of an achieving side, I’m happy.
I’ll try and learn a lesson there; at least it hopefully shows that I’m human and passionate about the Villa.
Anyway, moving on, it’s a year to the day that Dean Smith took over as Villa manager and it’s gone very well hasn’t it?
I’ve said previously that I don’t think Smith is some kind of God.
He’s a manager/coach and they come and go all the time.
Yes, you occasionally get the likes of Stein, Ferguson, Wenger and Shankley etc, but they’re incredibly rare.
That said, you can’t fault what he’s done for the Villa up to now.
His aim when he first came, was to try and achieve promotion.
Maybe not at the first attempt, as we looked like we never had a prayer, but definitely on the second.
He achieved that first time, which I thought was very impressive, although maybe slightly lucky, with Grealish coming back at exactly the right time.
That might seem a bit mean-spirited, but then I can counter that I also thought it was an inspired decision to make Jack our captain, which I didn’t fully agree with at the time.
It all makes sense, doesn’t it?, because a Manager and Captain who are both Villa fans just adds to the good feeling for the club that we now have.
Let’s not forget where we were just before Smith was appointed: a manager who played pragmatic, boring footy, where the fans had become bored to near death.
I genuinely hope Dean Smith can continue to push us on and I currently think he will. To survival and more.
And then add on good owners.
They’ve not said a lot, but have demonstrated intent once again, by pumping another £57 million into the club, making it about £250 million so far.
Even by the Premier league’s standards, that’s a serious amount of money and is to be massively applauded. For some reason, I doubt it will be the last either. I don’t know what they have in mind for us, but you have to think it’s big.
And then the racism thing came up in the comments.
I have to be really careful what I say here, as everything seems to be taken the wrong way, these days.
I don’t know the actual words of the song that was sung and have no interest in even looking for them.
What I have seen is that there was some sort of reference to Nakamba’s (?) appendage.
I don’t know if that’s the worst of it, but if it is, I admit to being slightly perplexed.
If you sung that you thought I had a big ‘un, about me, I’d probably be embarrassed, but not upset in the slightest.
Indeed, I’d probably counter that the missus thinks I’m hung like a hamster.
God, I hope that’s not true (it’s not, I’m just normal).
The point is, it’s said jokingly and means nothing, so I’d just laugh it off.
And it makes no sense to me that Villa fans would sing a racist song about one of our own players, particularly when he’s done really well for us up to now and is being praised everywhere amongst Villa fans.
Racist? It doesn’t seem like it, to me.
Massively stereotypical is more like it and while that’s not right either, it doesn’t seem to be in a bad way.
I’m bound to upset someone with that comment, but please be aware, that I don’t know all the facts.
Whatever, the club itself, seem to have led the protest/complaints and that’s a good thing, particularly when I believe there is a massive Asian market ready to be tapped on our doorstep and further out.
Hopefully I don’t upset anyone with my comments there, but am possibly bound to have.
I’ll remove the racism part of the post if asked, no worries.
I was going to comment on the racism at Norwich the other day but didn’t get round to it. Also any opinion I have was based on what was said on TV. I did find it odd though that our own supporters were singing / chanting something about Nakamba, our own player. Racism is wrong although I don’t think it was meant to be nastiness, probably more naivety and misguided, especially in current times where everything is scrutinised. Bernardo Silva obviously didn’t mean anything malicious but has been reprimanded. I worry that any form of banter is getting extinguished from society. For my sins I watched BGT and there was a black American comedian joking about a white girlfriend! Should white people get offended? My partner works at a housing association and had a training course where the description blackboard was offensive but whiteboard Isn’t! I do worry that there are too many people out there getting offended on other people’s behalf’s. Yes, let’s cut out nasty racism but please leave some common sense and sanity.
I haven’t heard anything said on TV.
That’s similar to my thoughts though, where blatant racism is surely aimed at those you don’t like, not those you do?
It’s really difficult to comment, because as you say, what’s banter to some is incredibly offensive to others.
And the usual option is to just wring your hands and apologise profusely, because it’s just easier.
It just seems things have been taken out of context, to me.
But, as said, I’m not in posession of all the facts.
“Eggshells” and “walking” spring to mind.
We are all afraid, even to discuss the subject, for fear of being branded ‘racist’ – as can be clearly seen in this post. This attitude is neither right nor is it healthy.
Words, in themselves are not harmful but the way in which words are used is. Like the example of blackboard / whiteboard which is clearly ridiculous as they both accurately describe an object. (Not confined to ‘racism’ either – think manhole now must be an inspection chamber!).
Society seems to have lost both it’s sense of perspective and humour which is sad.
Did the Villa fans mean anything disrespectful – I don’t know (and I have no idea what the words were) but I find it hard to believe the words were sung in a hateful way given they (reportedly) were directed at a respected Villa player by Villa fans – but that doesn’t really matter does it?
Would those same words directed at, say Grealish, given rise to any comment? But if the words are deemed abusive and directed in an hateful manner (which is surely what racism is) then it shouldn’t matter what colour the player is – should it?
I’m old enough to not be classed as a snowflake or PC gone mad (it feels as though you guys are the types to use those phrases though) but I have seen the words used and they refer to his dad being a Rasta and McGinn being his master as well as large appendage. Collymore comments made some sense if you care to read them. Used to read this output with some interest but have to admit to being a bit put off now!
The words ‘woke politics’ springs to mind. If you can’t openly discuss things, how ever are you meant to achieve a reasonable consensus? No Platform, equals No Debate.
Ah fair enough.
Certainly that latter part puts a different light on things and of course isn’t good.
I’m not defending things here, but would just ask if, in yor opinion, you think the words are deliberately derogatory or just massively misguided?
I’ll try and find out what Collymore has said, although I don’t normally listen to him, tbh.
Oh dear! Next time you are at a loss for a topic in an international break – remind me to tell you about the 3 London Lions who were murdered. It might be less controversial.
Football songs are made up starting with finding rhymes for the last words in a stanza. Nkamba was not going to be easy. Rasta and Master – obvious, but poetic license triumphs over truth.
One day we will play a team with a few fans of Nova Scotian origin and Blue nosed Bastard will cause a fit of the vapours. Bluenose being a nickname etc.
The negative pettiness of the teenage schoolgirl triumphs over common-sense, but ignore it, its a fad.
Badger, I liked yours and the follow up articles. We live in an era where offence is taken at the slightest statement made. Then whipped into a frenzy on social media through a toxic snowflake mentality.
I work in a sector where if one person perceives something, as for example, racist, then it is their reality and must be treated as racist. I abhor racism and believe that any racist should be banned from our club. However, I also have no truck with those who are lazy, bigoted or politically motivated to call others racist to take a perceived higher moral ground and have morally and ethically denigrated their opponent.
In situations like this there is a need to establish a motive. At this point I struggle to see one for Villa fans to disown someone wearing our badge and establishing himself as someone who could be very special.
There are many players of differing nationalities, religions and cultures we have unequivocally supported. Moreover, let’s think of all those players we as Villa fans hold close to our heart:
Ian Taylor
Dwight Yorke
Eugo Ehiogu
Dalian Atkinson
Paul McGrath – need I say anymore. The man we call “god”.
Don’t forget Tony Daley.
Excellent comments, chaps. If would seem that there is still some sanity in the world. Obviously, the song isn’t racist. Although the ‘master’ line implies Marvellous is inferior or a slave, which is in very bad taste, it’s simply to create the rhyme, as OLL said. If it’s about the large ‘ahem’, then that would make Sir Alex, ironically a Scotsman, racist for calling Dion Dublin’s ‘ahem’ “magnificent” and “like a baby’s arm.” High praise, indeed. So it’s the ‘master’ thing that’s upset people. Big Ron lost his slot on ITV for comments with very similar implications.
Anyway, what is galling is that real racism is getting worse and the hypersensitive individuals who were upset by the Villa chant would do well to consider if they’d be so quick to video and call out a bunch of ultras on the continent calling monkey chants and throwing bananas. That’s what needs to be stamped out, not creative use of language to celebrate a player from the team you support, albeit misguided and cringeworythy. It warrants a wry smile, a tut, a roll of the eyes, and a shake of the head: what you do when silly boys do something silly boys do.
It’s always easy to go after the ‘soft’ criminals, but are the same people willing to make a noise about the proper, nasty, gritty stuff that nobody wants to hear? I recall a Villa ‘fan’ n thd Holte End viciously yelling “f****** b**** b******!” at Gary Charles for misplacing a pass back in ’97. That’s the kind of thing people should be making a fuss about.
As for the blackboard point, if it wasn’t so sad and pathetic, it would be funny. I demand that all supermarkets pull black pudding from the shelves; black Friday is immediately banned; the black country region must be renamed urgently, as well as Blackpool and Blackburn; and all casinos must retire all the blackjack tables asap. In fact, sod it, let’s just pretend the colour black doesn’t exist and rename it.
Badger, you shouldn’t apologise or be scared to talk sense. That’s what these lunatics want!
UTV!
Ah, but I do have to be careful, because I run the site and am liable for what’s shown on it.
What sums it up for me, is Sid’s comment about Paul McGrath being known as “God”.
We Villans are not racist, to my mind, by any means and the fact that we’ve been accused of it in the press disturbs me.
That said, I’d like to know who put the video out there, or more importantly, made a big story out of it, because if it was the club, I think they’ve shot us all in the foot.
I remember singing “no hair, the ref has got no hair” at one game.
I hope I don’t get accused of being “hairist” or “baldist”.
Different topic and looking ahead a bit, I hope Smith plays a second string team against Wolves in the cup on the 30th. Our squad has enough depth to do this, and more importantly, it’s Liverpool at VP 3 days later. Wolves are a damn good team. I think 90 minutes against them, then Liverpool and the way they play, will be too much for the boys.
Remember the last time we played Wolves at home then didn’t rest players? It’s the other way around this time but same principle. I think we can give Liverpool a game if everything falls into place, so to speak, but the first 11 can’t go 90 mins with Wolves 72 hours earlier if we are to give them a game…
Ooh, that’s a good question.
I agree that if we’re at full strength and rested, we can definitely worry Liverpool, with the way they play.
But then, Wolves have bigger fish to fry don’t they, in the Europa league, a week after?
They might be thinking of playing a weaker side too, where we should take full advantage, imo.
If it was much later in the season, where our survival depended on it, I’d be minded to agree.
But this early on, I’d go all out for the result, purely because Smith seems to have something about him, where it wouldn’t surprise me if we actually won the cup.
Martin Samuel has waded in and insists the song is racist. About the ‘master’ line, could it simply mean that McGinn is the ‘master’, the boss, of Villa’s midfield? Some of the points Samuel makes are plain daft, like some people think all black people are Rastafarian. Really? Ok, let’s assume there are such people, does it mean they’re racist, or just a bit thick?
And the stereotyping about the particular part of the anatomy. Would it be stereotyping if someone said black people have afro hair? Stereotyping is not the same as racism. David Walliams and Matt Lucas wouldn’t be famous without stereotyping. Likewise Harry Enfield. Are they racist?
The only sensible comment Samuel has made is to point out the fact that the snowflake who took the video and broadcasted it has given this non-story a disproportionate amount of media attention. Once they did, of course, AVFC had to come out and condemn it.
Sometimes, sometimes, it’s more prudent to ignore idiots rather turning the spotlight on them, pointing and screaming like the proverbial “goody two-shoes.”
I do wonder if Mr Samuel is pandering to the current climate of hypersensitivity with his article.
The same Martin Samuel who writes for the bastion of neutral, non sensationalist, reporting that is the Daily Mail? It seems so.
I actually love the paper for it’s pathetic ultra right wing replies, where the readers will have no truck with anyone wanting a Brexit deal or seeing any good at all in immigration, fwiw.
So it was the club who escalated this?
Bad choice, imo, as while it seems we’ve been quick off the mark to condemn this sort of behaviour, which is good, we’ve also given ourselves needless bad publicity.
i watched the international yesterday. what a complete waste of my Friday night. i would love to her honest opinions about jack grealish and if we think he could improve this england side.
for me england lacked anybody who could carry the ball past their opponents. to me its seems our plan last night and every time england play, is to pass the ball to death. we over play and get no where doing so. i won’t even mention the defending.
what jack brings to the team is, somebody who doesn’t just want BUT demand the ball in tight areas. he actually is somebody who can cope with two or three players around him. as we know this releases our other players.
playing against england is easy. everybody knows how to play us. its hardy rocket science. we pass fast one way and then switch playing fast the other side, hopefully creating some space, what we need is somebody who beats his marker and creates spaces and openings for the rest of the english players.
Nath, I didn’t watch the game.
Mainly because I think we’re poor and massively over-hyped.
From what I have seen previously, we have a good attack, coupled with a poor defence and a midfield that is disjointed.
Henderson isn’t the answer in an England team, as much as he might be good in the Prem.
So yes, Grealish might be an option, but you need to play out to him and just the same as the Villa are vulnerable to the counter, so I think England would be.
Whatever, Keane looks poor and I believe showed it again yesterday, when we’re being threatened.
Is Mings the answer there?
My England hat on says no, tbh.
Its pretty much what i said on another post Nath, England players was caught out with fast tackling, quick finding spaces, ,not one of England’s players held the ball or took the opposition on, Mount, Rice, Keane, and what a waist of money with McQuire. Grealish and it was said on here wasn’t ready for Villa, Grealish is Ready for England they needed his talent last night, he is what needed to create openings. I’m sorry I’ve not posted lately as I’ve got my son seriously I’ll and its taken up all my time to be with him. NATH % correct on your post.
sorry missed your post but will scroll back, when i get a minute. you are correct thou jack is ready and needs to be given a chance.
i know jack is not the finished article, but he is still miles ahead of the players southgate is picking and persevering with. i am amazed he has been constantly overlooked. like england is awash with players better than jack and more effective at what jack does.well.
Nath, Horse face only got the job because he played the FA game and still does.
He is a crap manager, who has won nothing, even when massive money was thrown at him when he was at Boro.
Good defender for us, but that’s about all he has to his name, imo.
I don’t know why he’s stayed in the game as long as he has, because he’s a blagger.
Get a truly innovative manger in, I reckon.
It’ll still make no difference though.
Our players are over-paid and don’t have the desire,, imo.
Can you name me a single England player who seems like he’d bite your head off for a win?
i think we have some decent players badger, but southgate isn’t picking them lol or playing them wrongly like mount the chelsea lad who was at derby. played him in a position he is unfamiliar with on his debut.
our defense is dodgy and holding midfield is also weak. but i don’t want to get into that, i just watched yesterday and its very noticeable. like bill said we have nobody who takes on their opposite number / marker.
you cant make many openings by simply passing and upping the tempo. teams get to know your tactics and defend accordingly. also we are not blessed with many intelligent passes, that can open up defences with one ball.
so you need a few players who can carry the ball, taking it past tight defences and making spaces by doing this. grealish does this for fun
i think mings would improve the team also. he is a player that want to win and he would demand this from the rest of the players. i saw a few english players arguing with each other. so they do care, but i think the tactics was wrong and player selections wrong and that means southgate needs to look long and hard in the mirror.
Nath, I disagree. We have plenty of intelligent passers. The Czech defence was opened up on several occasions in the second half. The chances weren’t taken, however, hence the final score.
i sorry we will have to disagree. i thought we were poor and as for opening them up, i missed that. we had a few chances but nothing to get excited about. also the opposition were a very poor side and we made um look far better than they was. the guy who got their winner plays in the usa. that says all you need to know about their standards.
we are neat and tidy and we pass the ball well if not put under pressure, but a country who consider themselves world beaters. i don’t think so on the last two performances, we lack invention that is including somebody, who can open up with one pass and somebody who can carry the ball past a organised defense. we also can not defend for our lives.
you have a holding midfielder venturing out of his position, getting ahead of the ball and then a central defender covering this by moving into midfield and leaving us with a 2 on 3 situation at the back. we were poor last night and against the best we have no chance. if we continue to play this way
Ooof, those comments are extremely harsh on Southgate, Badger. I think after his exploits at last year’s World Cup, he’s earned more respect than that.
Let’s work backwards. Allardyce: proper blagger with a seriously dodgy side and plays hoofball. Hodgson: good managr but failed to inspire the team or the nation. Capello: no comment needed. McClaren: inept and couldn’t handle the big names. Erikson: treated the national team like an exclusive club for a select few. Only got as far as the quarters in anything, despite managing the ‘golden generation.’ Keegan: inept in every department. Need I go on?
Southgate has managed to do more than all of those combined in the short time he’s been England boss. The fact that he’s a gentleman is a massive bonus in this day and age. His buzzword last year was ‘humility’, an endangered word these days that most people don’t know the meaning of. He’s restored pride, given youth a chance, his team plays good attacking football, he doesn’t have favourites, he got within a whisker of a World Cup Final…
He doesn’t play games. He comes across as genuine, not a bullshitter or an arselicker. I, for one, hope he’s England boss for years to come, and with a bit of luck, he might just win the Euros next year. If not, England will go down fighting, not like the showers of shite of his predecessors!
Bill, it sounds like you’re having a really tough time lately.
I’m wishing you all the best fella, as I’m sure many regular readers are.
Yes, hope your son gets better soon, Bill!!!
Thanks lads, unfortunately its anytime, big big shock…
😔
Jeez, sorry mate 🙁
Awful news Bill. Wishing you strength to cope with the shock.
Bill, only just heard of your terribly sad news. Thinking of you and your family at this difficult time.
BFR,
You’re probably right, especially when you look back.
My point is more that Southgate has never won anything and the last WC was tailored for us to win it and it will be a long time before we get such an easy route again.
Yet Southgate still failed as soon as we came up against a decent side.
My prediction is we’ll never win anything under him and I’d be 100% confident in saying that.
That said, you make a good point in demonstrating that it doesn’t matter what manager we get.
The problem seems to me that once our players get England status, that’s it: they’ve made it.
The value goes up and the wages rocket. Job done and they couldn’t give a toss after that.
In fairness, if I won the lottery (which I don’t play), I’d possibly think the same too and would retire tomorow, at least mentally, even if I stayed in work.
What I’m saying is I don’t think they have that desire; the edge, like say, the Germans do.
National team managers have a unique set of problems. On the plus side they have not spent anyone’s money on the players they choose. Therefore they do not have to face an owner when declaring a player turned out to be a square peg for a round hole. They are not expected to stick with the player and try to improve him or adapt the team’s style – instead they can drop him for someone else.
On the other hand they do not have any dressing room camaraderie to rely on. In a club side players with good team spirit will try to help a colleague cover his weaknesses and play to his strengths because they know they are stuck with him. In a national side the players will get the hump with the coach’s selection of a player they think is wrong for the role. Keane obviously, but also Rashford in the current England side being cases in point. Rashford was a whizz-kid, but has not developed into a player with the necessary football brain-power to play at the top level. I detect other England players do not think he is good enough.
Gabby only 33 years old today. What a waste of a career.
Sky are reporting that Mings might start for England, replacing Keane.
If so, I hope he has a good game.
I hate these qualifiers but tonight I will be cheering for Tyrone Mings as he gets his debut. Also because I don’t pay any attention to these internationals, I only just found out that McGinn got a hat trick against San Marino, so congratulations to him. Let’s hope we don’t suffer any injuries before the weekends more important fixture.