I’m stunned.
The first half sounded superb and Tony Morley suggested that the first half was the best we’d played for around two years. Indeed, it sounded like even Westwood, Gabby and Hutton were playing really well and Johnstone hardly touched the ball.
At one stage, it wouldn’t have been a surprise if we were 4-0 up; we were that impressive.
So what happened?
We went in two up at half time and things should have been very comfortable.
Nothing changed when the teams came back on and we retained the same 4-1-4-1 that seemed the best balanced we’ve been in a long time.
Yet we still managed to let them back into it and this surely has to be a mental thing?
Steve Bruce, who I don’t see got it wrong today, even though I feared for us from the off when I saw the line-up, must quite simply be pulling his hair out.
I predicted a 0-0 today and I’d have taken that.
But to have played so well in the first half and still end up drawing?
That’s a massive 2 points dropped, whichever way you look at it.
There are plus points in that we showed that we can do it.
But we have to show more resilience if we’re going to get to the play-offs.
Lansbury looked ok and that’s another plus.
Along with us retaining our home record.
Oh, we got two goals too.
But I’m still massively disappointed.
Comments
974 responses to “Villa 2 – 2 Preston; We threw that away”
It’s the four maybe going that are intriguing me.
I’ll bet it’s not who I’d like to see.
Actually Badger it’s five if you include the swop plus cash player (my money’s on Ayew).
So four more – has to be one midfielder (at least – wouldn’t be surprised to see Tshibola go out on loan plus one other mid fielder sold) plus McCormack and Kozak. Sadly I think Richards and Gabby are here to stay – wages too high.
I want Gabby, Richards, RM and Kozak gone personally!
See we’re ‘monitoring’ Ollie Watkins – young striker at Exeter. So we’re not ignoring the rough uncut diamonds in the lower leagues.
Hitch….yes, its about time our scouting system found some hidden gems. Forward thinking with Bree and Bedau and perhaps Watkins…..I like it. Think Hutton will be sold in the summer too when De Laet recovers.
Agree with the Hutton scenario. Personally I hope he gets a good gig as he’s never let himself down, respected the club and always tried his best. Can’t ask for more than that.
Me too mate. I have great respect fir Hutton. One of the very few who didnt throw the towel in last season. I wish him well wherever he goes.
Agree with you and H60 – never understood why so many gave Hutton stick on here over the last few years: sure, he’s not the best player technique-wise that we’ve ever had, but far from the worst – and he’s always put-in a full shift, ran himself into the ground when others just stood about waiting for someone else to do the hard work.
R.I.P . Ted Small, Mr Villa all the way, worked with him for 20 years, he loved our club immensely. Condolences to his family.
Hitch, you’re correct, of course!
Five then.
There will be no resale value for Hutton in the summer.
He signed a 3 yr contract in Sept 14.
Wouldn’t surprise me if we’ve offered him an out, maybe even on a free, so he can maintain nearer his wages/ get a nice signing on fee. Loyal servant and all that.
Can’t argue with the choice of players, except I’d add Westwood 🙂
Not even good enough for backup, imo, plus I’d definitely keep Gardner over him, even though he’s been poor too.
No chance though and he’ll probably be at Villa longer than Bruce (sigh).
Badger, I think you have a bit of a ‘thing’ about Westwood!
Personally I don’t beleive he’s any worse than Gardner, and I’d suggest that succesive managers at VP have seen something in him which the rest of us keep missing.
Gardner is another one of those ‘great white hopes’ that we’ve produced through the junior teams and whom some people on here have been raving about for the last couple of years: admittedly he’s not had all that much first-team playing time yet, but just like Grealish, I still wait to see exactly what all the fuss has been about…
And you’d be right in thinking that Ardent.
I just can’t think of a more pointless player down the Villa, ever and god, have I seen some.
It’s why I specifically mentioned Gardner as a comparison.
At least we know he played very well at Forest, so there’s still a chance for him.
By many accounts that I’ve read, Westwood looked good against Preston.
Until Lansbury went off, where he looked lost.
Says it all, imo and if you’re only any use when you’re being carried, you ain’t good enough.
The amount of losing Villa sides he has been on surely can’t be co-incidence?
He’s had tons of games and has been average at best.
That said, I don’t think Bruce will be averse to losing any of our mids.
Apparently he made a point in saying that none of them were capable of making any movement.
That’s as damning as it gets imo.
All I’ll say is that Westwood works hard. Other than that he’s not exactly ‘produced’ anything impressive on the pitch for me either – but then that applies to almost everyone who’s supposed to have been in our midfield over the last 5-6 years!
As for Gardner: look back through the archives on this site say three or four years; countless times people on here moaning that we’d loaned him out to other clubs when he ought to be playing for Villa.
Well that was when we were still in the PL. He’s hardly set the world on fire in the Championship [for us or any of the teams he’s played for in this division] so all those earlier calls for him in the PL team were a bit premature. Trouble is that so far he’s not really looked as if he’s much more effective than Westwood in this division either.
Agree with Ardent on Westwood. I feel exactly the same as I feel about Hutton. Good professional with limited ability. In his defence, he has never played alongside decent midfielders which may have held up his progress. May have been alot different if he was playing alongside a Barry or a Milner.
Agreed, Ardent.
But I’d take you back to Gardner’s time at Forest, where the fans wanted to keep him. Maybe he can still come good.
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t go a bundle on “we must play our own”.
It’s not relevant nowadays.
It’s just that I’d give Gardner a bit more time, whereas Westwood has had plenty.
That said, I wouldn’t miss a single one of them much, as they’re not good enough.
Westwood isn’t useless. There’s very much room for him in the team if we finally change styles, though unlikely under Bruce. He’s always needed leadership next to him, that for for us to play a passing game. You’re right, he’s looked poor this season, because he always will when we play so defensively. He’s very much a Britton type player, who for accounts still is running that Swansea midfield. Westwood was hyped heavily in Lambert’s first season because we dominated the ball, hell we dominated a Rodger’s Swansea side. Pass and move is his game, and clearly it’s not Bruce’s. He should leave to better his career. But he’s the furthest thing from useless in a good, possession style side.
And Pep was going to piss the league this season.
Yeah and Chelsea fans wanted Conte gone after 5 games. Things happen. City need an overhaul in midfield and especially in defense (mainly fullbacks).
Or is it the case that he ain’t in charge of the most dominant, richest team in a piss poor league?
Pep the man the myth.
Both Newcastle and Brighton out of the cup. Has to be on purpose surely?
BTW anyone remember Antonio Luna aka Tony Moon? Playing a stonker for Eibar in La Liga right now.
An assist for a certain Carles Gil of Deportivo
Always liked Gil, but there is no room for him and Grealish, imo.
In Jack’s case I’d guess he;s going to have to make that room himself.
The challenge for him is that he’s only going to get 10-15 minutes now and again as a sub and he;s going to have to make an impact or that will be all he’ll get.
Might not be a bad thing either if it forces him to improve and be more consistent.
Is he going to make the most those 10-15 minute cameos – or like many others, just sulk that he wants to be more than an impact-sub?
If there’s no room for either, then Villa will again lose technically gifted players for lesser “harder working” players that can’t get results.
Andrew, we’re not in the Prem, where skill comes into it more.
The Championship is a man’s game, where you need to be able to give as much as you get, because most of the other clubs don’t have a player of particularly high technical quality.
It effectively leaves you a man down, if one can’t get stuck in and it’s why the vast majority say we’re too lightweight.
Even tackle dodger Westwood comes into this category, imo.
Yep, there’s a case for using the very technical types to draw fouls and I’ve called for it as an option at times with Grealish.
And I said there’s no place for both Gil and Grealish, not either.
Probably just came across wrong.
Grealish’s father/agent confirms we’re not allowing Grealish to leave for Swansea in any swap deal. Great news.
It is good news – but I really hope that the player realises that there’s a point where ‘promise’ has to give way to actual ‘achievement’…
Very true, hopefully with attacking players coming in, we’ll see a style that suits the players like Grealish, Westwood, etc better than a McLeish type style that suits… Well no one.
****update****
My guy saying Bedau almost done and its likely that he will be loaned back to Bury for the rest of the season.
Probably because it was confirmed by their head coach already, that he’s joining us and he wants him on loan for the rest of the season.
I think its the right thing to do personally…..what do you think Andrew?
At 17, he’s only played 7 games so far for them. Their manager seems enthusiastic about him. I’d let him to stay. He’d play for our U23 team, no chance he’d get game time for us yet. So let him stay I say. I’d loan him out again next season to them as well.
Agreed Andrew. I feel very much the same about him. The only possible downside is that the style of play/tactics between the 2 clubs may be completely different. In other words, when he arrives permanently at VP he may have to make major adjustments to his game….what do you think?
Very true but like all youth players you have to take that chance. Do we want him playing for the U23’s/18’s or whatever or playing under a manager that seems to really rate him and will likely give him a chance or two every now and then? No idea how much managers pay attention to who they loan too in terms of playing style. Probably the best would, like Klopp, Pep, Conte etc, but unlikely for most.
Andrew…good point. Lets just hope it works out longterm…
Alan Nixon (Daily Mail)…..suggesting Tshibola to Forest on loan. Never read the Mail so not sure if he’s reliable or just another lazy journalist!
It’s actually a decent online read Langford, if you can throw it’s politics and celebrity crap to one side. In fact, probably the very best, judging by it’s viewing figures.
The comments are hillarious and highly recommended!
And about as reliable as anyone else, in that they get it mostly wrong.
Although, while the likes of the Star are awful, I actually think the papers have been closer than usual, on the whole.
Probably because of Xia’s input?
Ah – not trying to be clever (OK I am 🙂 ) but suggested earlier that Tshibola would be loaned out. Actually makes a lot of sense; we overpaid for him (sound familiar?) but he does have potential and needs game time to develop.
Hitch….sorry mate, must have missed your post ….very humble apologies 🙂
Oh, it’s recently gone down the same route as the Evening Mail, in that it runs loads of terrible scripts that can lock your browser up.
If you do take a look and the page doesn’t load in a few secs, get the hell out!
Although in fairness, the local mail has improved of late.
Actually I think that the B’ham Mail has been pretty close to most of the moves over the last 10 days too.
Been following their updates [via NewsNow] on all the Villa activity and at times they almost seem to have someone sitting in the boardroom at VP with his phone on !
Cheers for that! Tshibola loan does sound feasible. I still think he can come good. Giving him playing time elsewhere makes sense. Perhaps his loan is part of Dr Tone’s cryptic message?
Will keep a keen eye on Alan Nixon’s twitter from now on.
Something else that has struck me about this window – with the exception of Gestede (and it’s pretty clear he wanted to go and we should have expected McCormack to perform) we have concentrated on getting in the better quality players we want before shipping players out. How many times have we complained about selling players without knowing how they would be replaced and then buying someone of lesser quality?
Yep….agree 100%. General rule of thumb for me is ….get in better olayers before releasing anyone. Its completely irrational in my eyes to sell before you buy, unless you have little choice of course.
Hitch, I wonder how much of that is down to the fact that we’re stuck with quite a few on big wages?
And we got rid of Cissohko before getting one in.
Ok, not the best, but the only backup we had.
And realistically, we still haven’t spent much.
Point taken though if you’re talking about the mids.
At least it looks like Bruce is trying to get a replacement in. Be it Neil Taylor who’s not much of an upgrade to him and is injured till early February.
Personally I rate Taylor and expect him to oust Amavi from the team
Good god I hope not. Taylor’s currently injured, and will be no better than a back up hopefully.
Fair point Badger; I’d forgotten about Cissohko 🙂 I know this is arguing against myself but I suppose Baker can play left back and we have Elphick who can play CB – and then there is Richards?
For Cissokho…see Hutton. Good enough defensively in the Championship IMO. I’m not overly keen on this wing back malarkey. FBs should be primarily be concentrating on defending. It is different of course if you have Kyle Walker and Danny Rose in your team! Horses for courses and all that!
Except that wasn’t it Sir Ron who virtually invented the wingback with John Gidman??
And was years ahead of the game with his core strength philosophy.
Your probably right but I do think you need to be a exceptional talent to be a wingback. Gidman had that IMO. I dont think either Hutton, Cissokho or Amavi are good enough to play the role. For me, Amavi goes forward well but is not as good as Hutton or Cissokho as a purely defensive player.
On the subject of
Sir Ron Spinksy was on the wm phone in and was asked what he (Sir Ron) looked for in a young player, his answer, “sharpness”.
Does that apply tho young Mr G?
I suspect that Sir Ron would have lost patience with Mr G after half-a-dozen games.
You mentioned ‘core fitness’ earlier – and Grealish appears far removed from posessing that; Sir Ron also expected his players to get stuck-in and not just be passive observers of what was happening on the pitch away from them…
And two touch counter attacking football, fitness and square pegs in square holes and Deadly’s ego got in the way of us and a possible decade of dominance!
He then he sells to a buffoon yank that ends up in our demise from the top flight and we name a stand after the prick.
I’d like to see the stand re-named, BWS.
But out of respect for his age, not until he’s passed on.
Ellis will never be seen as part of our overall heritage, imo, simple.
How can he be, when our biggest achievement was only achieved in the middle of his tenure, but he wasn’t involved?
You’re right mate after Nosferatu’s exit stage left.
And no he wasn’t the Bendal’s had the helm, I believe he got back on board in 80/81and it was the beginning of the end of something beautiful mate.
Nah, I think BWS is great but name a stand after him…… 🙂
The Billy Walker Stand?
Not a bad call Hitchy.
Lol.
Just re-read that and ok I’m flattered but come on lads.
I’ve always been an advocate in wide defenders being able to defend first.
I think some of us forget how good Gidman was as a defender, although he could get forward too.
Certainly the first RB I noticed playing more the attacking RB/WB role was Earl Barrett.
Think about it and there really aren’t many good WB’s out there.
Walker’s a good example, but he was caught out as much as Hutton at times while playing for us (still learning granted, but it’s an inherent flaw in the role).
I’m convinced it’s a limited option in the long term; one that can be out-thought with decent wide play. It relies on players that have massive engines who might be better off as mids.
I know it’s old fashioned, but I still believe the 4-4-2 takes some beating.
It’s just that it has to be flexible.
Same as any formation, I guess.
You just need better quality players, regardless.
Why not play Amavi as a wide left attacking player not at LB. Now who was it they converted like that ….. Gareth somebody or other!
Oh yes and a another Gareth started at LB and moved into mid field.
Goes back to what I said in top WB’s are probably being played out of position and wasted overall.
Barry was a major loss, which is what left such a bitter taste, imo.
Amavi being moved up, i could live with.
And he’d probably be better overall.
Star are suggesting that we want RM out, with us being willing to pay half his wage.
I suspect there is some truth in this, as much as I detest the Star as a source.
Well if the Fulham-squad stories are to be believed, and given that SB seems to have burned his bridges pretty well in public with RM, then I can’t see any way back for the player with Villa.
If someone wants him [prefereably not a direct competitor!] enough, I’d settle for cutting the wage bill at least a bit, and getting him as far from the club as possible.
Personally I’d be asking Birkir if anyone in the Icelandic league might want RM.
I never normally agree with throwing money away but we’ve done so well in this window I personally think we should write him off and get him out ASAP. We don’t want his toxicity spreading in the dressing room.
We’ve had far too much of that in the past couple of seasons.
Apparently Norwich have enquired. I personally don’t care who is willing to take him, they can have him. Huge waste of space, he’s been garbage since he joined.
Agreed,
He’s finished at the Villa and will never play for us again.
There’s no way Bruce will stand for it.
And the truth is, I love it.
Get the strokers out, whatever it costs, imo.
And he can go to a direct competitor too. It really wouldn’t worry me.
Seems someone’s playing a big PR game re: Grealish and the brum Mail are complicit.
I wonder who’s behind that?
The fact is, he needs to start performing and not continually showing promise, imo.
Honestly think that Jack’s going to be a bit player for the rest of this season at best and it’s his own fault.
He was in a situation where we were incredibly light in mid-field for quite a while and he still couldn’t hold a place down. What chance now with Lansbury, Bjarnason and Hourihane in the picture? Very little I suggest.
Even if he does come good in the future I’m personally disappointed that he couldn’t do it when we really needed him.
I posted a piece that I read elsewhere comparing Grealish with Gary Shaw which in hindsight might have been a tad unfair on Grealish. Why do I say that – mainly because Gary Shaw played in, arguably, Villa’s greatest side with players like Withe, Morely, Cowans and Mortimer whereas Grealish has been playing in one of Villa’s worst sides! To expect a 21 year old to prosper and be a game changer in those circumstances particularly where he is marked by the opposition is perhaps unfair.
Having said that he has been disappointing and never really showed that semi final form again – other than for the England U21’s where he looks a really good player but is playing in a better side.
Shankley once said – ‘is he a good player having a great game or a great player having a good game?’ With a better midfield I suspect with Grealish we are about to find out.
Now that was a Team Hitch, you could put a monkey in and get a good result, sorry I don’t agree with Badger on Grealish, yes lightweight he his, but arguably he still has a roll to play at Villa, give him one more chance I say he knows the score now he goes or play football, give him that chance.
Sure was and will never forgive Deadly for dismantling it
@Bill
Not arguing that he shouldn’t get another chance but I watched a La Liga game yesterday and a young 18 year old called Rivera played in mid-field and he gave a calm and assured 90 minute performance and looked really good. We’ve never really had that from Jack.
Also note that Gil got subbed after missing a good chance, he still hasn’t scored for Deportivo this season.
@Pat
I agree he’s not putting in 100% in a game I can see that, but he’s a target when he play’s, other teams mark him plus rough him up, he has to learn the game as it is today, he now got the chance to be protected by his new team, Pat I see his talent lets not throw it away like Albrighton and Downing many more in the past.
@Bill
Well I’d guess you’re right that he has been a target at times probably as he was basically the only creative mid-fielder on the team so if the opposition got him out of the game that was our mid-field gone too.
It will be quite different now with players like Lansbury and Hourihane in the team and if he does get a game he probably won’t be so much of a target as he has been previously.
But he’s now got to do it if he gets the chance because I don’t think that SB will give him many more.
I’ve just read the Birmingham mail on Grealish, they are not fans with comments like that , like die, break your legs, evil sods.I lay a bet if they had to fight in a war they would hide.yellow swings.
Bill I agree, if people are posting such shite it’s bang out of order but could there be more to that piece in the Mirror?
Reading between the lines then perhaps it’s young Mr G’s way of justifying his imminent exit?
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/jack-grealish-opens-up-sickening-9714728
Could be BWS, you don’t need fans like that, makes me feel for him.
If it happened Bill.
C’mon gents, we’re living in the times of The Donald – where anyone can ‘tweet’ or post any abuse they like, under any name they choose…
The only thing I don’t understand is why any sane individual would want to read this stuff; why any ‘celeb’ [or anyone who happens to find themselves in the news, for that matter-] then seems to go straight onto Facebook/Twitter/etc to read what they trolls say about them?
Ardent, don’t do facebook or Twitter, why would any sane person expose themselves to leaving themself open to abuse, both are there for lonely individual’s ,imo.
Bill – same here, never used either.
That was my point/question – why would anyone want to read things when they know that there are lots of sad gits out there who simply post abuse about anything/everything?
True Ardent, maybe he’s lost his drinking mates.?
And call me a cynic but who’s to say he didn’t tweet himself???
Look they don’t love me, all they do is abuse me blah blah blah