It’s not that often these days, where I can’t take my eyes off the game to go to the toilet or get myself a beer, but this was definitely one of those days.
I said in the preview that I thought Liverpool would get at least 2 goals and that part proved correct, but what I didn’t expect was such a resolute all-round performance from the Villa.
Make no mistake, there will be a few non-Villa fans saying we really aren’t that bad a side.
Ok, if I hold my hands up, I’ll say Pool were overall the better side.
But we defended so well for long periods that if we’d drawn, I don’t think it would have been undeserved.
You can’t knock Liverpool, because I got the feeling that it wasn’t going to be their day, given the chances that they created, but ultimately put well over the bar. But the fact that they came back from being a goal down with a few minutes to go, says it all. It’s the sign of a top team.
But while we lost, which was no disgrace against one of the best sides in Europe, I saw plenty to be pleased about.
While I think we missed Grealish, who I think would have found a few more gaps today, his not playing wasn’t the end of the world.
Dean Smith played well in using our wide players to stop theirs playing.
El Ghazi played well, as did Targett, but it was Trezuguet who gets the MOTM for me.
He gave Lovren a torrid time, got the goal, was close to getting a second and just worked his socks off. A brilliant performance.
If I have to moan, it would be because we constantly gave the ball away, every time we tried to clear it.
That said, Liverpool’s movement is excellent and they just put you under the cosh, which I guess makes defenders a bit panicky, but it’s something that bugs me whoever we play.
I still don’t know what to think about Wesley, but I’m afraid my opinion of him goes down a little with every game.
Is it the way we play that doesn’t suit him?
He just never seems to be where it matters for my liking.
Which is where I’d have liked Kodjia to have come on earlier. I just think his quicker (albeit sometimes clumsy) feet might have suited this game better.
And then there’s VAR, which I thought was disgraceful today.
Ok, both decisions went our way, but they were so close it shouldn’t have been used at all, if the aim is to correct obvious mistakes. As I said in the previous replies, both goals looked ok to me and if the ref got it wrong, it would be understandable.
I just don’t think the way VAR breaks the game up is justified with such close decisions and I don’t want things computerised for everything that isn’t an obviously good goal.
It’s supposed to be about CLEAR and OBVIOUS errors and that’s not what it’s being used for, imo.
Anyway, enough of that.
I’m proud of our lads today, simple as.
We’ll be okay, I’m sure of that, after today’s showing.
Gutted, but upbeat at the same time.
It’s no disgrace losing to Pool and even Klopp has suggested he thought we’d beaten them.
very good assessment of the match, i cant be critical of the players, i thought they gave everything they had, to see out the win. but up against a very good team, who never gave up themselves and were rewarded late on.
this was one of the best performances we have done back in the premiership. i think so, because we had a complete team performance. we defended pretty well all game. we carried a threat on the break and we really should have added a second. the quality of the opposition today, were pushed all the way and into injury time,
this is the standard now and a few players seemed today to hit very high standards, if they can reach these heights regular. we will have a good season for sure,
I was at the match and am equally gutted. Not sure how to assess it but will make a few comments:
I would consider keeping Luiz, Marvelous, and McGinn as the first choice midfield for every match, not just against the top teams. We seem much more solid and competitive with these three in the middle, which is what you need at this level.
I would then seriously consider playing a front 3 of either Jack, Trez, and El Ghazi OR Jack, Kodjia and Trez/El Ghazi – I have supported Wesley all season, but after seeing him today, I think he needs to be taken out of it for a few games at least. One of his main attributes is supposedly to hold the ball up and bring others into play (he did this brilliantly against Everton) BUT today, nothing stuck to him – everything just seemed to bounce off him. I felt sorry for him at times because the refs give him nothing when he’s being held, and even give decisions against him for ‘backing-in’. But overall, he looks the proverbial ‘little boy lost’, despite his stature. At one point, he was lying on the ground, as if waiting for everyone to go over and see if he was OK. He’s got to toughen up if he’s going to make it.
Personally, I’d like to see if El Ghazi can play down the middle, with Jack and Trez on either side – a much more mobile and dynamic front 3 that would worry most defences. Having said that, their equaliser was due to El Ghazi not tracking Robertson – disappointing, to say the least, and something that has been levelled against him in the past, although he had a good game overall.
It was a tremendous performance but I would point to how little work Alisson had to do. I would have hoped for a few more pot-shots, at least, from the likes of McGinn and El Ghazi, but they kept us at bay.
We sat back far too much in the second half, and only have ourselves to blame. At one point, Alisson was playing on the half way line, which says is all.
When we did break, 2, maybe 3 times, we made the wrong decision – the worst when Trez broke away, put someone through (didn’t see who, as I was in the top row of the Trinity) but that someone chose to square it to Wesley instead of shooting. WHY?! If they’d put their laces through it, it would’ve been a goal – very similar to the position for Targett’s goal against Brighton – maybe it was Targett again?
Anyway, going back to Wesley, me and the chap next to me ended up laughing at how bad he was – he is a passenger at the moment, in the most important position – just before he was subbed, we had a break away but he was stuck in the centre-circle as if standing in quick-sand, when he should’ve been busting every bollock to keep up with play and get into the box. Another occasion, when McGinn burst into the box, got to the byline and centred, he should’ve been arriving like a train to bury it, taking Alisson into the net with him, but it never happened. These are my observations so I think it’s time to give him a breather.
Big games coming up against teams around us. We knew we’d probably get 0/0 from the last two, so now we can take the positives and hopefully go on a little run again. A draw at Molineux followed by the mashing of Bruce’s Newcastle at VP would be a good start!
UTV
P.s. to put things into perspective, the European Champions and PL Champions elect only just managed to get past us, needing every second of stoppage time to do so.
BFR, first game for my grandson at 13 the reason being he play’s twice at weekend and in the week, rang me to say it was electrifying to be at the match in the Holte end. I watched the game at my sons bedside and was proud of the efforts the team put in. Glad you seen what I was saying about Wesley he’s weak as a centre forward, the thing is will he get better.
The Holte was indeed in great voice again, Bill. It was definitely more electric for the Everton game – maybe the summer and the evening kick-off contributed.
The team definitely put a shift in, albeit with some novice errors. And sadly, yes, it would seem that Wesley is really struggling. He didn’t even have a shot. There was one moment just outside the box and everyone shouted ‘SHOOT!’ but he squared it to a teammate instead. I think his confidence is pretty low. He looked a shadow of the player I saw vs Everton. I’m not defending him any more, but I just wonder if the way we play isn’t helping him. Against Everton, Jota played two slide-rule through balls for him (one was for his goal) and he did get on the end of them and get a shot off for both. But how many times has he played ‘off the shoulder’ of the defender with through balls played to him? It hardly ever happens does it? He is always with his back to goal with an opposing centre back’s arms around him, trying to lay it off. Something’s not right, that’s for sure. Up to Smith to sort it. We’ll need at least one striker in January though, no doubt!
Sending best wishes to you and your son, Bill. Glad the grandson enjoyed it, despite the result.
UTV
Ya absolutely gutted again today. I thought our luck had turned against Brighton too!
I just watched the highlights again, and their 1st goal is excellent. very hard to defend that. The goal from the corner was poor, Hourihane should have done more to stop that.
However, a very positive performance from all of our players, and you have to think we played without our star player.
i havent watched the highlights. you are right the goal pool scored from the cross at our back post. that was a good attacking goal, caught us cold as their was a little stoppage just before the cross which interrupted the flow of game. el ghazi got lazy tracking back for the first time, he had tremendous game up to this error.
the corner flicked header, this was bad defending by all the team. pool had been trying this routine all game loading back post and paving the way for a pool player to flick on near post, but all game we matched them and blocked thier runs and efforts to pull this move off. but i remember kodjia being near post and hourihane both of these were at fault. this sort of lapses happen more when you tire or when your introduced as subs, both these were subs
I noticed they did that 3 times and almost scored. I’d like to know why Mane didn’t get booked twice beforehand , it was clear to me he was out to disrupt Villa. But still proud of Villa and their wanting and fitness in that game, Wesley was the only one to be under Parr on the day, its coming Villa as the commentary said are a class club and the atmosphere was something else.
pool did things in repetition the deep cross to back post and the near corner flick ons, were attempted loads during the game and in all their games i seen, they are good moves and they are good at them. i think the corner caught us out because the subs were not up to speed at dealing with them like the rest of team. but they should be and these are little issues, shows how much progress we made to lose on such small details.
i thought wesley did good. he never had any chances in front of goal which shows how much pool were dominate. but he never hid from the grafting side. he kept their two central defenders busy. he also brought on our midfielders runners. this allowed us to stretch pool in the channels (spaces which their full backs vacated)
i really believe we have improved loads this season. with each game we are learning. getting more premiership street wise. but playing pool and city. we have learned more about the finer details which make the differences at this level. if we can apply these lessons to lesser premiership clubs we will be fine.
Wesley is NOT a target man. Smith seems to think because he is 6ft 3” and has the physique, that means he is going to be as good as Benteke was for us. He is easily bullied and often sits there throwing his arms in the air to everyone’s annoyance. Personally I don’t think we should have signed him. The money would have been better spent on Maupay who suits Smith’s teams more anyway. Davis is a better target man if he wants to switch things round. As for Kodja, I will be glad when he is offloaded. At all his previous clubs he had a good first season before becoming a luxury player.
We must pay whatever it costs to sign a goalscorer in January because all the other positions are well covered. Maybe El Ghazi could fill the CF position which would offer us a more mobile front three.
We have massively important games coming up after being sucked back towards the bottom three. Hopefully the players won’t be too disheartened and will bounce back based on decent performances against the top two teams in this league.
Totally agree with all your points, Holte.
Also looking at our next 5 games without my claret and blue tinted glasses, I would say only one (Newcastle at home) being one which I would predict us to win. Wolves, Man Utd, Chelsea and Leicester are tough and any points from those games will be a surprise. Newcastle winning well away to West Ham means that game isn’t a given either. Tense times ahead probably.
True, they are tough games, but at the same time, we could get something out of all of these games. At least with our team now, there are no games which we know we are going to lose. We have a chance in every game.
I totally agree on Wesely Holte, i seen that posture from him weeks ago but nobody agreed with my assessment on him, told give him time , even then it’s whether he meets the heights of the rest of the team. Don’t fully agree though on the thinking we don’t look like getting points on the 5 games coming up. My next door neighbour travelled to London for the West Ham game and said they was poor full stop. I think we are on the right track and don’t fear anyone up till yet. Yes we need a striker in January that’s for sure.
I’ve just put my claret and blue tinted glasses back on Bill and you’re right! I can see us picking up points from all our next 5 games. 🙂
TBH, if we do play to our potential and catch them on a bad day, then you never know.
I am going to be in a minority on here, in being more worried about our survival after the last two matches than I was before.
I don’t rate Heaton very highly as a keeper, and expressed that disappointment when Villa at last recognised they needed a better keeper but brought Heaton in instead of someone else. He is a good shot stopper but I question whether he reads the game – and thus positions himself – well enough or quickly enough.
Also we continue to sit back in defence against the better teams and we are not good enough at it, there will be defensive errors or just balls going loose which end up in the net. If the play was in the other goal mouth we might profit from it.
Where I agree with the views expressed here is about Wesley. Given the above are our tactics against better opposition, Wesley is not the right player to be up front on his own. When we play opponents sitting back in their box – he will be.
I’m also concerned about our survival.
Receiving plaudits for playing well having failed to register any points is all well and good but, at the end of the season, it’s points that are going to count not nice words!
Too often our play and endeavour has been praised where we’ve not picked up points and the stark fact is we have now lost 11 points from winning positions – the most of any team in the Prem.
The next five games are far from straight forward and may well define our season – we have to find a way of hanging onto leads – if not for a win at least to secure one point.
On Wesley, I’m still in agreement with OLL but do we play Kodjia up front against Wolves ‘cos he’s the only option as far as I can see.
From Villa Park
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Jack Grealish is fully expected to be fit to face Wolves next weekend.
We take on Wanderers on Sunday, with a 2pm kick-off at Molineux.
Grealish didn’t feel 100% in the build-up to the Liverpool clash this morning so ruled himself out of the Reds contest.
But boss Dean Smith should be able to call on him as we look to get the better of our neighbours.
He said: “He will be fine for next week.
“He trained with us on Friday but woke up this morning and just felt he wasn’t right.
“He had a little run on the pitch pre-game. But I told him I wanted him to be 100% because you have to be against teams like this.
“He wasn’t so he made the call and I certainly supported him on that.
OLL/Hitch,
I think we need to keep some perspective here.
We’ve just played by far the two best sides in the league and we got exactly what practically all of us expected – nothing.
Personally I think we did better than expected, given that we took Liverpool to the wire.
I don’t see the need to be so worried.
Keep playing the way we have been and we WILL beat teams. Add an improvement or two in the window and we’ll probably get a bit better.
Yes, we have issues, but as an example, we’d never have beaten Norwich 5-1 away last season.
We have massively improved and it’s all about survival, which I think we’ll achieve quite early. Just as well really as our run-in is tough.
We don’t look like a team that is going to go down and many pundits think the same.
Keep the faith.
I’m quietly confident.
Fair enough Badger and I agree re Man C and Pool except we should have secured a point in the Pool game same as we should have secured at least a point against Arse.
I would be feeling far more confident had we done so,
See our Carabao Cup QF with Liverpool is being played without a date change. Liverpool will play with two separate squads, one for this game and one for the WCC Final the next day – something Klopp said he would not do!
17th December Hitch, its been confirmed.
Bill, interesting that the Club seem to have over ruled Klopp. I guess, by what he said, that he would have preferred to withdraw rather than trying to run two separate squads. Still, we have to take advantage of the situation and put out a strong side.
Interesting indeed. Hopefully it’s because the club’s hierachy believe it would be disrespectful to just forfeit.
If so, good for them, imo.
It’s good news for us, as surely Pool will play a much weaker squad for the Carabou cup?
Hmm, Carabou or World club Champions, which one shall I go for? 🙂
I believe the game’s been chosen by Sky too.
I agree Badger that Liverpool appear to be respecting the Carabao Cup which must be the right approach but, and fully understood, their priority is obviously going to be the WCC Final. We have to put out a strong side and make the most of the opportunity.
Good to see we are going to be on the box as will be back home on 16th so will enjoy watching the game.
I will quote the Holte End, Hitch:
“VAR…f****** shit! VAR…f****** shit!!” – repeat with intensity and a simple melody.
Or try this one:
“F*** VAR! F*** VAR!” – repeat until voice fails.
Son’s red card overturned – another failure by VAR as one of the protocols is to check on red cards so that ‘injustices’ are avoided!
Wrong thread! I’ll try again…
I will quote the Holte End, Hitch:
“VAR…f****** shit! VAR…f****** shit!!” – repeat with intensity and a simple melody.
Or try this one:
“F*** VAR! F*** VAR!” – repeat until voice fails.
So that means VAR is now being judged?
IE, three layers?
I don’t worry about it too much.
We possibly got two shouts in our favour against Pool, but as I said, it shouldn’t have been used at all to my mind.
Things will change, I’m sure of that. Especially when you have pundits who half liked the idea of VAR, yet now can’t defend it, as I’ve seen written today.
Looks like Pool are sending out the tea lady to play Villa. We better bloody beat them this time!!!
I’m confused about Liverpool’s two squads.
Each match will require a first 11 and 3 subs minimum.
That’s a total of 28.
Assuming their Premier league squad is the same as the Carabou cup squad (and why wouldn’t it be?), how does that work when you can only register 25 players?
I must be missing something.