Long time readers will know how much I hate loans, to my core.
First, I believe it is a cheat, like at Everton having players they can never afford to have brought or pay the wages.
Second, I believe it is a total sign of failure of a club. Loans are needed because generally a club is in trouble and the summer signings failed, what kind of faith is that in Lambert ?
Third, all this does is to lower the wage bill at another club.
I will not talk of the two players in depth because it is irrelevant to me who the players are, i never want to see ONE SINGLE LOAN player in a Villa shirt. If we need the player then just go out and buy them, we HAVE THE CASH.
Let me repeat that ….
We have the CASH to buy Holt and Betrand
It is as simple as that. Some say a loan deal is best in case we go down, well if we go down with these players they were not good enough, surely you have to have faith in the manager to buy ?
So I see this as a lack in faith in Lambert to give him the cash and if that is the cash why is he still in the job ?
Wasn’t the plan to build for the future, how do loans do that ? for me they do not.
However think about this ….
If we are about to get taken over then any new owner would be daft to keep Lambert. Is this a sign that Lambert only has a short term future anyway ?
Comments
143 responses to “Loans – Lack of faith in Lambert or no future for him ?”
Andrew…are you serious in saying that Bertrand is not muck better than Luna and Bennet?
From what I’ve seen of him? He’s about average at best. Though I wouldn’t mind seeing a Bertrand/Luna combination (Luna as the winger of course).
Rumour has it one more in but might not be today but b4 the window closes.Maybe Lambert has had loans because whatever money he has got off Randolph he’s saving for some creativity on a permanent UTV
Both these signings are short-term fixes. In other words, make sure we stay in the division and then a probable takeover in the summer. I don’t think we’ll spend a single penney this window.
All that rubbish that Faulkner spouted earlier in the week with regards to long-term planning, the next 5 months is as far as the board are looking.
Let me put this out there. IF they are planning for the long term then why is our manager not being offered a new contract? Afterall, he’ll only have 1 year left at the end of the season.
It all points to one thing, a takeover.
totally agree with you on that and I wished Faulkner had been asked in his soft interview about this …
Every sign since basically Houllier left has shown Lerner to be going but I think some are in denial about that. Not sure of course Lambert deserves a new contract but if not offered one soon in the summer then the signs are there.
Ian…so when are you going to answer my SIMPLE question above?
was that a question ?
Personally I think we would be more than capable of getting 40 points without a single loan. If I was Lerner I would say you have brought two LB’s already you get the best out of them. Do we really need cover for Kozak ?
Why is it we want a left winger/nubmer 10 he is not prepared to play Grealish ?
Ian…yes a very SIMPLE question…just needs a YES or NO answer…i will repeat it here!
We get no one on loan, whilst others do. They stay up, we dont.
So is it rational and logical thinking NOT to use the loan system that is available to one and all? YES/NO
Only just seen question. With or without loan signings we will stay up so how is loan signings building for tge future when they go bk in tge summer. We could buy an am that will keep us higher in the table and he will be our player. Loan signings dosnt feel the same even if like Ian said if it was Messi I’d rather not have him if it was a loan. And btw no one has been more negative about the club as you in past few months. As soon as we sign a player that isn’t ours you start having a wankfest and think everything is great with club again. Lerner sees fans like you coming a mike away!!
Oohah… That was just a YES/NO question…i am sure you are more intelligent than you are making out? 🙂
He’s not offered a long term contract because he’s shit. He’s lucky he’s still in the job
Totally agree Oohah, the only thing he should be getting is his P45!
I only said that because it backs up my reasoning for a potential takeover.
its the jan transfer window, clubs can get their pants pulled down with deals done in this window, inflated prices, greedy agaents and club desperation.
im not usually in favour of loans especially youngsters loaned out to prem clubs as a training ground for the likes of man city and so on. in this case if we havnt got the right player available id rather get in a loan till the end of the season than spend 10 mil or whatever and then have it not work out, id rather we take our time and find the ‘right’ player not just an available player.
its clear we need some players in and if loan deal in the only way then so be it, its short term band aid football but a current necessity.
Loan players from the sky four smacks of a club with no ambition and are thinking small. The club is a joke
Would you rather more league 1 shite signings? Be happy we get to replace Luna and Bennett for the remainder of the season
Oohah…same question to you …YES/NO answer please!
We get no one one loan and go down, whilst others use the loan system that is available to all and stay up.
Use loan system or not ….YES/NO
Still no I’d rather go down
Kind of like Lukaku and Barry who you wanted? Believe you mentioned Milner back on loan too… But I guess City’s not technically a Sky 4 team so only Lukaku which makes Everton a joke of a club.
I don’t remember mentioning lukaka for a loan. I did say if cb had gone I would like to have him sign for ud but not as a loan
But he was never going to sign for us. He’d have cost around 20m+.
but we would of had that from selling benteke
loans are a short term fix yes, Holt in to cover an injury , and Betrand in to cover Luna who is shit. i do not think walker was a bad move a few years ago,only thing i don’t like is know right to buy at end of deal if any good.
If Chelsea get Shaw now or in the Summer, we may get first dibs on Bertrand so a loan right now seems perfect, just to see what he’s really like.
Why would Bertrand leave chelski on twice to three times what we wud pay him to join lamberk and Lerner in their quest to make us the most boring mediocre club on the planet. It won’t happen even if they sign shaw he will either play from the bench or go abroad or to another sky 4 team. No player with any quality would come to vp now and who could blame them
IAN… we cannot sign players for 5M and 40K THIS WINDOW..
What do you want us to do.. buy another 1M 10K a week player.. don’t buy anyone or loan a talent like Bertrand..
Will you and Oohahh get some perspective FFS.. instead of spouting the same old bollox..
YES we all want proper signings but to keep harping on about it to justify every post is ridiculous..
rather Bertrand than Luna for the rest of the season.. on loan or not..!!!
yes we can buy those players, who says we can not ?
Surely you do not believe the spin from the club and it’s friendly reporters and leakers ?
do u actually work for the villa ?????? cos everyone who is someone at the club av openly stated aston villa will not recruiting over this window ~ we did our recruiting in the summer ~ believe that or not, but thats the facts ~ so lambert is adding 2 the squad in the only way he can
Like I said there is no need for a loaned left bk when we could use money to buy an am that will be here for long term. We won’t go down this season whether Bertrand is here or not. Totally pointless
The OWNER says we can’t.. you know the one who SANCTIONS the deal.. i am not saying we can’t afford it.. i am saying the owner is not ALLOWING it.. maybe due to a takeover you banged on about all well and yet in the same breathe u want him to buy players when he is selling..
Stick to one argument will you.. who when they are selling is going to splash the cash..
Plus the point is instead of going round and round on the same point you have to some times take each situation as it is.. in which case and current circumstances Bertrand is def worth getting in..
Also everybody laughed at West Ham because Roger Johnson is SHIT.. not because he came in on loan.. did anyone laugh at Everton on here when they took Barry and Lukaku on loan…. NO..!
well = week…
Anyone notice how both Ian and oohah are unable to answer YES or NO to my VERY SIMPLE question. Is this not definitive proof that they are only capable of spinning negativity?
Please stop knocking the club just for the sake of it. Its tedious and childlike!
Yes mate i think their affecting me,ive never been so fucking depressed in my life.ive never drank so much either. 🙁
And me,
Bill…did you buy that box from ebay mate?
Not yet will do, just trying to get it on computer, next month,
Cheers Bill..please let me know if its any good. It certainly gets a good write up on ebay.
Its time for us to unite again. Forget the owner, ceo and manager for now. We have to survive again and hope for better next season.
We will NOT be relegated!
Liverpool 2 Villa 2
I’ve got a laptop with xbmc on. its great for films etc but the channel quality isn’t always great. i use a free site to watch the villa games live, in hd, no buffering etc. Can admin confirm if I am able to list the site hear and if not suggest a way i can get the info to bill, langford etc? it’ll save you a few quid
Bill, Langford – Badger is going to give you my email address, drop me a line and I;ll provide you all the info for the site I use.
Jaymo
The way I see it rightly or wrongly for what ever reason the club are not spending any money I think that every villa fan should be glad we’re improving the squad even if it is a loan deal. Weather you agree with them or not its simlple fact we need a player like Bertrand at Lb.
No we don’t need a left back we will stay up regardless of Bertrand
I don’t think there is any real debate here as to whether Bertrand is an improvement on what we have already.
we have dodgy fullbacks
he has proved less than dodgy for an entire season at chelsea last year.
Loans..
if he does well so he goes back ..
is it much more different from all the good or better players that we are all upset about not buying to date?
effectively we lose out on a player we were never going to buy. but after he helps us for 20 games or s.
I think its the same old story
we are not spending 50-100m on transfers and wages every years
thats the only real roadblock to a marked improvement in villa’s fortunes if you want serious progress very quickly.
otherwise this is just another tiny (but in my opinion marginally positive) step along the way to trying to improve without throwing cash at it.
I think some posters on here need a reality check. They need to realise that we aren’t the same draw for players as we used to be unless we pay stupid amounts of money on wages and fee’s which is what got us into this mess in the 1st place. Before the usual suspects use the same old boring comeback “happy with mediocrity”, I’m not happy with the situation at the minute and won’t be until we are challenging at the top end of the league again. Even then I still won’t be happy most probably, because I want us to be the best in the league, Europe and the world.
What I am though is a realist and realise that this is the situation we find ourselves in and that Lambert is doing his best with little to no funding for whatever reason Randy has given him. The only people that know what is going inside the club are the owner etc.
Back on the topic of loans, I am quite content with the 2 that we have bought in. Holt is a straight replacement for Kozac as back up for Benteke. Those going on about giving Helenius a game, I agree but he is a different type of player to Benteke and Kozac/Holt. If we were to lose Benteke for a few games again like earlier on in the season would anyone really want an unproven youngster to come in and get demoralised when the inevitable boos rain down from the crowd? Just think of the potential damage that could do to Helenius, where as Holt will take it in his stride. I would be pissed off if it was a permanent deal for him but it isn’t.
The Bertrand one is more straight forward, bring in a player with Premier League experience and let either Luna or Bennett go out on loan to get some confidence back or move either one forward into an attacking role if we decide to go with wingers.
Sorry for the long ranting post.
Agree with your comments we all accept the situation but dosnt mean we like it. We have no choice to accept it or withdraw support
It is the acceptance of it that clubs (not unique to Villa) hope full and basically screw the money out of the fans.
Cardiff fans accepted changing the shorts for money
Hull fans accepted money but then moaned when the owner goes mad
Pompey fans accepted a crook as long as they won the FA cup despite it being on bent money
We accepted Lerner because he was not Ellis ….
at some point fans will say no more on mass, what is that point for any fan differs ….
for me the change of Aston Villa as a name, colours or the ground would mean looking to start FC Aston Villa (FCAV) because those are totally unique to us.
Reading through Red Bull threads it appears some idiots accept even that for money
Make no excuse for calling them idiots BTW
All I’ll say on this is Chelsea’s 3rd best LB is better than our best LB?
Says it all for me.
I hope he can play tomorrow, because I’m dreading what I might see at Anfield
Ian just one simple question, what do you want from the Villa ?
Ambition, thats all, not settling for lower mid table as a way of labelling success, showing real intent in the market when we do have the cash. In all this people forget that.
Lets take it away from liking or disliking loans…. It goes to show young and hungry, the foundation for the future and building for the future is all absolute bullshit and we are all suckers if we listen or believe anything that comes out of Lambert or that fat useless twat Faulkner !!!! end of !
Well something has changed, Faulkner said we are improving, well guess points at this stage we are. Last winter crying out for experience and look who we got. This winter a slightly better situation and we appear to have changed …
Why ?
seems more desperation to stay up this winter than last winter ?
could it be we need to stay up for a deal to be concluded ?
Spot on saddened how can we build for the future with loan signings. Complete bull shit but anyone with half a brain could see that years ago
I think the only reason why they have ditched the young and hungry etc is because that was last years PR bullshit……Oh and they don’t have a clue how to run a football club and treat its fan base.
we won Europe in 81, it’s now 2014 open your eyes.
I’d rather keep them closed and hope it’s all a bad dream!
Come on guys, a loan is absolutely normal in these days. And all about football isn´t logical and can´t be planned on table. You have players who are sensational with one club and a complete disaster with another one. Hundreds of reason for that. Thousands of wrong transfers done in the past, but nobody wanted to do so. But it happens.
But first Ian, some points to your post: “you hate loans”, so there will be no fair discussions about it.
“Its a cheat because others can´t afford their loan players” – wrong, because Everton pays the wages of Barry.
“its a sign of total failure”: why?? you have some weak positions in your team, you have injuries, others out of form, maybe a possible transfer target but you don´t know how he would cope in your team. All possibilities to make a loan transfer. Maybe your loanee was injured before (I read Bertrand was), so you are not sure how he will do. Many reason justify such business. And yes, its all about results – why not strengthening the whole team with one or two loanees and to improve the level of performances.
“To lower the wage bill of the other club”: total rubbish and not relevant. Its not the reason why Chelsea are loaning out, they want to give a young player playing time. And we need a left back. So where´s the problem.
In an ideal world, every transfer you do will be a success and nobody is injured. That´s not happening. The only time I have experienced such a scenario was 1980 when we won The Big One.
For my feeling all this constructions are a little bit too much. PL has lost it – take over in the near future – loanees are the proof for it. Maybe but maybe not.
I am happy that we have some hope to improve our team and performances, which makes me much more happier if it does.
Disagree joty Barry is a Goan loan Bertrand isn’t. With Barry we would have a chance to keep him for 2-3 years with Bertrand he will be off to Chelsea. I’m sick of us becoming a selling club and finishing club for sky 4. Top teams don’t sign players on loan. We can’t even hold onto our only decent prospect in our history in cowley instead he will be wearing an arsenal top. The club is now a pathetic shadow of its former self it’s a local and national joke. Until lerner goes and I’m still convinced it will be years then this is it.
We’ve been a selling club for 15 years – Don’t tell me you’ve been this miserable for that long. Ha
Wev been a selling club since we sold andy gray to wolves in the 70s the difference was sir Ron built an even better squad of players with the money that won us the league and European cup. If we sell Benteke can you see lamberk doing that not a chance in hell. From a premier pov tge selling club started when southgate, eughio and boeting preferred middles boro ffs and then on to a new level which confirmed our downfall and the beginning of the end IMO when we sold Yorke. Wev never really recovered from that IMO and sent out a loud message to tge sky four that Aston villa no longer want to compete. We improved in the early days of Lerner but still needed that world class player to take us into tge top 4. Lerner bottled it and so did MON.
ooha, you are right but the club is what it is atm. We are a selling club and we are a pathetic shadow. And we are and were in a relegation fight the last few years.
And if some loan deals give us better performances and results it will do me good.
We shouldn´t moan about everything. When the club doesn´t bring in new players we moan about that and when they bring in new ones we moan too. When we get young players we moan about inexperience and when we get older ones than we moan about players who are finished.
The era of splash the cash which we had about 3 or 4 years ago are over. We have to accept our current situation. Maybe it will change but until this time will come I try to be a little bit optimistic.
I can’t accept it joty if lerner can’t take us forward then fair enough. But sell us to someone who can
These loans just show Lamberts incompetence in the transfer market. He has two left backs available now (both his signings) and neither are good enough. He also has 5 strikers but still feels the need to bring in another one. Helenius and Bowery? Why did we sign them?
I think Bertrand is a good player and I hope we end up getting him on a permanent deal but if we do that we will be his third attempt at signing a left back in 2 years!
What is more worrying is our major issues (central defence and midfield) ahave not been addressed. I am worried about tomorrows game, The way Liverpool are playing, I can see us getting hammered again.
No shock tonight that James Nursey (sucks up to Lerner) says that no perm deal attached, course not. Remember those who claimed we had a perm deal with Walker … no chance.
So yes if he plays well some fans will get their hopes up only to find he wants 40K a week and deal dies …
The fans are thinking far too short term with all this and not looking at the wider picture and that is what the club wants.
Ian, we can´t change it so let´s accept it. Everybody can turn his back to the club but I am not capable of doing it. I love this club and are deeply disappointed about the current situation but I try to be supportive and optimistic.
What would have fans wrote in such blogs back in the 70´s when we were playing in 3rd division. Maybe it will change.
Just accept it!!!!!!!!!! FFS! How spineless can u get!
they had hope then though … it could not get lower and we rose …
Where is the hope now ?
Back then players did move upwards but the names of that era stuck with us, Chico, Graydon, Lochead etc
Where is that now ?
Spot on Ian it’s just a stop gap signing with no risk to appease the peasants! Lerner knows he will go bk to Chelsea and the PR spin will be ” we tried our best to sign him but he is a Chelsea player and wants to sit in the bench on £80k a week when we can only afford £80 per week”,
“lets accept it” …….ffs if my mrs lied to me as much as this football club she would be shown the door…… Off topic, we have now been ORDERED to pay up to 1.2m for Jed Steer another fantastic piece of business mr faulkner and mr lamberk…. You two really don’t know what you are doing…..Fucking chuckle brothers of football..
Saddened you do KNOW to reach the FULL payment he HAS to win an England Cap…
WTF is wrong with that deal in that scenario.. a donkey won’t get an England Call Up will he!!??
If your going to have a rant at least make it constructive FFS..
And if he did make an England cap, that means he’s good enough to be out the likes of Hart and Forster, meaning we paid 1.2m for an England international meaning we can get a hugely inflated price for him if he was sold, being English and all. 😉
lets judge these moves at the end of the season…..a wise man said, so lets just see.
No Wonder Villa have no money,£ 450.000 to pay Norwich now raising to £1.120.000 for Steer compensation, does anyone at Villa know how to run a foot ball club, that Bertrand don’t look a bad player just have to see how we go, no chance of signing a regular player now , ho happy days. Still think loan players are unsafe to any team, but anything is better than nothing knowing what we have.
Presumably Holt has been brought in to cover Kozak who is out for the rest of the season. Why would you buy a player in this sort of situation when you know his services will no longer be required in a few months time? As for Bertrand, I can only imagine Lambert has woken up to fact that Bennett and Luna are both liabilities and he therefore needed emergency cover until a full time signing can be brought in during the summer. Maybe he wanted to buy him but Chelsea wouldn’t sell? Either way, if they’re good enough, I don’t care whether we’ve bought them or borrowed them, hopefully their quality will rub off on the rest of the team.
What some are saying is we lost one forward out of 5 and 3 are Lambert’s buys and thus the failure to get cover lies with Lambert.
should say to get cover in the team, or was it wasted £1M on Bowery when Wells went for £1.5M
I like your fire Robo.
Jack Grealish extends stay at Notts Cty after all……..
So Tonev will get the odd start on the left instead of Grealish, says it all.
JOTY mate in the70s we had hope and a dream and that dream came true.What we have now is no hope or dream just a buncj=h of arseholes running the club into the ground and unless change comes soon we will not have a club to support only what is written in history books.
Jaymo, no links to streams.
You know the score and we just can’t allow them mate.
Anyway, I did give a one-off link to the best site I know last night.
If you give permission to hand your email out to anyone who wants it, I will, using the addy you use on here.
Completely understand Badger, hence the reason I asked first. If you can provide my email address to Bill Pearson and Langford I’ll happily send them the info, likewise, if you need it drop me a line.
Cheers
Jaymo
ok mate, sorting it now
cheers pal
Sent using the address you use on here.
Which will now be totally forgotten.
For clarity, we don’t track anybody or pass on any info whatsoever, unless requested as above.
We should probably put that on the home page somewhere, tbh.