Joleon Lescott recently moved to Aston Villa from West Brom for a fee of £2 million as Sherwood looked to add experience to the backline following the departure of Ron Vlaar. And yet, he has yet to improve the defence and his experience doesn’t really seem to count for much. Lescott has been brought into the team, in favour of Clark and his performance don’t seem strong enough to justify keeping Clark out of the starting 11. Ironically, West Brom wanted to sign Clark as a replacement for Lescott.
Yesterday Lescott was exposed, badly. He failed to close down Milner fast enough, positional he has been very poor, and has been slow to chase the ball. Lescott’s best attributes are strength and perhaps defending set pieces. Primarily, Lescott would be better against more phyiscal sides, those who don’t like to pass the ball around very quickly. Which is why Lescott struggled so much against Liverpool.
To put it on a difference perspective, Lescott is yet to get a clean sheet in defence, whilst Clark has already gotten 2. What will happen when Okore comes back? Surely he is not better than both Clark and Okore. In August, when Clark partnered Richards, Villa conceded 4 goals Clark in the side. In September, where Lescott has primarily played, 7 goals have been conceded. That’s quite an increase. Clark does have experience, he has played over 120 games for Aston Villa, and as things stand, Clark is a far superior defender than Lescott.
Perhaps Lescott is playing because he has a personal relationship with Sherwood? It seems as though Sherwood does play his favourites as the likes of Gil, Kozak and Clark have struggled to find game time as of late. The answer seems simply, play Clark in favour of Lescott and our defence will strengthen. At least that’s what the numbers seem to suggest.
Pretty convinced he is not the lescott man city signed but neither is he past it.
Some of the comparisons here don’t line up. You can’t compare Half a month of Clark with a full month of lescott. And even then you have to take the quality of the opposition into account.
Overall though – our defense is not what it should be so far
Okore coming back might be a good thing. I personally rate him higher than Richards and Lescott. What’s happened to this Crespo guy? Is he still injured? We need to try something new at right back, we get slaughtered most games there.
When we were rumoured to be signing Lescott I left a comment saying that if he’s not good enough for Pulis he shouldn’t be good enough for us. A complete waste of £2m for me, Tim should’ve kept it in the bank till January and spent it on a RB or striker. Some Villa fans got excited by the signing, probably because he was ex England and Citeh, but I never even rated him them. I’ve a brother who used to play football at a reasonable level, and he could never understand how Lescott got picked for England, he thought he was nowhere near that level, he was right, and I’m sorry to sound a bit arrogant on this but any Villa fan who thinks he’s an upgrade on Clark, or even Baker are wrong. He’s a Villa fan, and that is how it should stay, a fan but not a player!
Agree Dave c I can understand to a point having him as back up as our injury record for CHs is dire. But he should only be played in meaningless cup ties or we are 6.0 up with 30 secs left then he can’t do much damage!
Hmm, many of us were complaining about Clark and while I think he’s ok, he does make some glaring mistakes.
I actually thought Lescott was coming as very decent backup, which we’ll definitely need in the next few months
Okore might well be our best bet, as I do like him.
But both he and Clark will get their chance.
As for Crespo, I’d expect him to be backup for if we get desperate.
At least I wouldn’t expect much more from a player who only cost half a mill or so.
I’m not keen on Clarke either but at least he can still improve. Out the 2 he is still a better bet over Lescott
Totally agree Adam and the stats back it up! Clark has been improving while playing in a struggling team and has show heart desire and leadership, yes he has made mistakes but name me 1 CB that never does?? Moreover name me 1 CB in a team under constant pressure every game that doesn’t make a mistake?? The fact is he has had shit fullbacks and a shit midfield in front of him for almost every game! Lescott has played in world class teams and been found wanting, he played in a well organised pulis team and still made mistakes too so how is he an improvement? Clark and Richards if given a dozen or so games together could form a great partnership IMO as both have leadership quality’s and put 100% into everything they do and hav a bit of speed lescott has looked lazy and slow, he was never a quick CB and he had hardly got faster the last 3 years has he? And our RB position is a massive issue so if it needs be Richards should move out there when okore is back and play him and Clark in the middle, they did well for a period last year with terrible fullbacks and shite midfield in front of them so with gana and sanchez playing every game and told to hold their position especially when out fullbacks are bombing forward I think we should be solid! They are young so there will be mistakes but I think with our attacking players we can score every game if allowed to stay forward and should draw or win a lot more than we lose! I would love to see us play like Leicester do attack and never give up and make opposition run towards their own goal at all times!
A lot of truth in that Adam, and Kerryvillan, so why did Sherwood buy a dud player?we knew that we was struggling in defense and unsure of Clark and a right back and now still its the same. To me its a solid no holds bard player in midfield and captaincy is called for, he could have had Barry, Milner, but no goes for Lescott, who got pushed out of City, Albion, ends up at Villa. we seem to be managers,players, retirement home to has been players and managers. looks like nobody will come to us only players that want our league and a work permit.
Clark is utter shit, i can’t understand half of the people on here championing such an average player, not saying Lescott is the answer or in fact an better, but Clark is awful.
I think Clarke is simply the lesser off 2 evils Guest!
Just like to add dissenting voice on here. I rate Lescott as better than both Clark and Baker. He is not a long term solution, but I really don’t think Clark and Baker are good enough. Clark might be with a bit more experience, but Baker is way too injury prone and will never be a Prem CB.
Overall our defence isn’t up to it. I’m including the players in front of defence as well. It is probably to do with training drills and organisation, but Bacuna isn’t a proper RB, Hutton isn’t quick enough, and Amavi is stronger going forward than defending (though looks like he can be good enough defensively as well). We need more protection in front of the back 4, and a better GK. It’s a collection of things not being quite right, and unless we get a proper defensive coach and the proper team ethic it’s not going to improve enough.
I watched Hangeland get MoM in the Palace/Watford game yesterday. He was paired with Scott Dann. Yes they looked solid, but I have seen them both look well short of pace and undone on a number of other occasions. CB’s like GK’s tend to look poor as often their mistakes lead to goals conceded.
We need to improve right across the pitch. I watched Newcastle come close to beating Chelsea, and the effort and commitment was tremendous. That’s just one game though, and not many teams can do this week after week (as Newcastle have amply demonstrated)
The most disappointing thing about our defence for the past few seasons, apart from conceding stupid and avoidable goals at times, is the lack of consistency, the fact that we very rarely play a settled back four or five. As we all know, this has been mainly due to the appalling situation with injuries. I would wager that, between them, Vlaar, Clark, Okore, Senderos and Baker have missed more games through injury than they have played. Clark has, at times, flattered us with some of his performances. I for one thought that, having watched him in the successful reserve team of a few years ago, he would be a dead cert to be a future captain. I don’t feel that he has ever stepped up to the mark and think that maybe he never will. I believe that Lescott needs to be played for the right situation. I know this goes against the lack of consistency point I have made but I don’t think he should be a regular fixture in a back four, maybe in tough away games when we could play three centre halves, with one sweeping. On the whole, I am frustrated more than disappointed with the start to the season. The issue we have is that we have a lot of players, definitely with greater ability than last season, who are new to the Premier League and are taking time to settle in. Some would argue that this is time that we can’t afford. Also Sherwood is still learning his trade as a manager and tactician. Unfortunately some of his decisions have been poor. He is quite obviously a manager who thrives on confidence. You only have to look at how things changed when he first arrived and then how quickly they changed again in the negative from the Southampton result. The performance in the Cup Final is the best example. All in all, the knee jerk reaction of some to oust Sherwood at this stage is not appropriate, I feel. However, should the situation become critical, there is no other option, in my opinion an that (opinion), Ladies and Gents is all it is.
Good post Mark but what is a critical situation in your eyes. Only 7 games gone and in danger of being cut adrift already. If this continues we could easily be adrift by 10 plus points by Xmas then there is no way back!
There is no specific definition of critical oohah. I know that as time goes on whilst we are in this situation, every game becomes more important to get something from. It finally becomes a case of forgetting about performances and just getting points, or “desperation” as it is better known. We are in danger of being cut adrift as has already been pointed out so, if that is the case, hopefully not, then the powers that be will need to act swiftly and hopefully make the right choice for the first time in ages.
Just to let you know, Grealish has opted for England.
At the risk of upsetting everyone on here, I’d play Senderos over Lescott, I know we can’t now as he’s not in the 25 man squad, but he certainly looked more reliable than Lescott in the few games he did play for us, and that was under Lambert when we were constantly under pressure! Plus he’s 2 years younger!!
Lescott was brought in to partner Richards as they “know each other” and Sherwood wrongly thought they’d pick up and play well together, needless to say Lescott’s awful and well past his Everton days. Has to be dropped, gotta bring Clark back in, who may make a mistake or two but doesn’t make half the mistakes people claim (kinda like the over exaggeration of Sanchez and his passing).
4-2-3-1 is probably our best bet, no 3 at the back, let Grealish and Gil run the wings with Amavi and Bacuna, Veretout behind Ayew and Gana and Sanchez together. Of course Ayew won’t start up front so that doesn’t matter anywho.
Are you on crack? I don’t care what centre half you play with that formation but it would concede goals for fun. Oh, and the goals come from? Lots of good footballers there but tactically you make Sherwood look like a genius. What have we learnt so far? We can score goals, particularly if Gestede is in the team (so let’s leave him out). We can’t defend because we have had too many players unable/unwilling to defend from the front backwards (so let’s pick them all together). You often make some very good points but tell me why your formation addresses our problems?
And BTW, unless I have missed something (quite possible), who said Lescott was brought in because he knows Richards? Richards probably knows a fair few CB’s. Why didn’t we go for another?
I think Lescott was probably first choice partner for Kompany (another CB who makes mistakes) when Man City won the Prem a few years ago (2012?). Considering the cash they have spent in that area that’s probably a sign that he isn’t too shabby.
I think your line up has two goals between them this season. OK a few haven’t had much game time but does that really look like a team that is going to turn our season around?
Fine, I’ll be happy to address your points.
We learned Gestede can score, but we’ve also learned he’s a huge liability, unlike Benteke he sucks with the ball at his feet, he has a worse first touch than Gabby and can’t hold the ball up at all. He always looks for the header instead of ever chesting it down and such loses it. He’s a liability and having watched Ayew, he can hold the ball far better, technically better and could score the goals up front if he had the chance.
Defensively that team is more solid. You’re right, Gil and Grealish won’t back-track. But no matter what, we won’t have any creativity without them. Veretout doesn’t have a problem dropping back, and Gana and Sanchez are our current best midfield duo to protect the back line. Of course if it didn’t work, then it’d need tweeking but it’s far from making Sherwood look a genius.
No one did, it was a guess. We could’ve gone for a host of CB’s, why Lescott? Lescott’s proven to be well past it. Hell I’d rather have taken Chester off WBA. You’re right, he knows a few, but he’s played at City when Lescott was there, so my guess is Lescott was brought in as a known partner to Richards and they’d know how each other played.
Yeah, but they spend a lot of money on every position, Rodwell, Sinclair, etc didn’t work out. Lescott was partnering Kompany but then Kompany had his best season by far, and has only gone downhill since then. That was also 3 years ago. Player’s change, look at Gabby.
Not really 2 goals, Ayew scored 13 last season, we have a better side and if set up right, technically he’s very good played up front. No reason he can’t outscore Gestede this season as a striker. Plus you realize we do have 3 subs a game, game changers. Allows us to bring on Gestede, Kozak, Traore, etc. That team would be technically very good and would set the team up not to constantly long ball it, but allow them to play real football, kind of like Lambert did his 1st season when we scored a lot, and didn’t only long ball it. Ayew’s very good if given the chance.
I would suspect that line-up till January would get us more points than the current 11.
Agree with everything u say Andrew except Benteke bit. He had a rubbish first touch too imo but agree Benteke is better with ball at his feet though Gestede not offside every 2 mins and hopefully not as injury prone. Also he’s scored 4 goals to Bentekes 2 in a poor team.
OK. So our most potent attacking threat is a liability. Interesting choice of words but I know where you are coming from. I think Ayew could be brilliant for us, and 100% agree he needs more game time. His 13 goals last season are no more relevant than Gestedes for his previous team.
Gil and Grealish are our most creative players, but how many other teams play two such players at the same time? What about Traore? He can go past players and is way stronger than those two. Don’t get me wrong, I would love to see us play our most talented line up. It just wouldn’t work against most teams (in my opinion).
As for 3 subs. Yes of course I realise that. Don’t you realise that Gil or Grealish could be subs as well? I would prefer to see one of them on the field plus Ayew.
Back on Lescott. He isn’t that old for a CB. It’s one of those positions where experience wins out over youth all day long. His positional sense makes up for his age. Yes we could do better, but I suspect Richards and Lescott will remain first choice, and I would go along with that. I just don’t think Clark is a better option. I remember seeing his home debut in a win against Fulham and he looked calm and assured. I’ve seen him loads of times since against much better opposition and been far less impressed.
I want Veretout in the side as well. Westwood isn’t creative enough, and as our specialist dead ball expert is woeful. I just look at the side you suggest and see weakness defending our flanks. Leaving our full backs exposed is a big part of our current fragility, and pulls our CB’s out of position.
We do need to change our line up, and Sherwood needs to work out our best team/system. If he goes with your suggestion and it works I will be first to hold my hand up and say you were right.
How do we manage fixing the flanks though? A 3-5-2 won’t work for us, having a midfield of a DM and 2 box to box midfielders lacks any creativity at all. Grealish can’t do it himself in getting Gestede goals and if we have to rely on our wing backs for crosses, than we’re not going to get goals either as having Amavi and Bacuna/Hutton doing that every game will have them knackered by November. My way obviously isn’t defensive, and would only work against teams outside of City, Chelsea and Arsenal, maybe Spurs and United too.
I know Lescott’s not old, but he’s been awful since he’s come in. Richards had an awful first game which Clark picked up the slack, but Richards then put in some amazing performances, Lescott’s yet to do that, and has actually had real playing time over the last few years, at CB at that, not RB like Richards. Clark’s a much better option.
I think Traore would out of the 3 work best as an impact sub, solely because I don’t think Grealish or Gil would have that same impact he does. They need to start and control the game, Traore’s got the ability to come on and turn it around easily, but then drop Gil and put Traore on.
Unfortunately none of this matters as Sinclair will still suck it up on the pitch, Gabby will play and Gestede will continue starting, Ayew will never be played as a CF and Lescott will continue to start too.
I think DS Villa nailed it earlier, we haven’t defended well enough in front of the back four – all too often, and Sunderland a real case in point, the midfield didn’t “anchor” when the runners bombed on.
I’m sure Lescott has been purchased for experience, nothing more, and on the right back side of things, let’s not forget that Llori has come in to fill that position, I would imagine that by the time we play Swansea he will be in – the right hand side is brittle and imo Hutton can only play if Traore is ahead of him.
Going into the Stoke game I think that chopping and changing the CH partnership is a huge risk, but maybe time to start Clark with Richards with the potential to try Okore after 70 mins if we are ok.
Additionally, play Sanchez in front of defence and make sure he stays in position with Westwood rested for Veretout to start with Gana, and please Tim, no Gabby this week, time to be brave with your own signings.
UTV
Is Okore fit? I like him but he always seems to be playing at full tilt. He seems to be stretching to reach the ball pretty much all the time. Maybe that’s why he seems a bit injury prone. Lescott looks a little calmer to me. We do need to try to get a settled pairing, or even better a settled back four. I think we can (and should) live with Amavis occasional lapses in defence.
I suppose a settled formation in front of that would help too. I just worry that Gil and Grealish are luxury players (much as I like what they bring to the team). I would probably add Sinclair to that group. We need to really dominate a game for those players to come into their own. We seemed able to do that against Leicester for an hour before collapsing. At the moment they are too big a risk to play together from the start.
I feel we have a pretty good team amongst the players we have, but picking the best team/formation is pretty tough.
Ah, Llori.
I’d totally forgotten about him.
Good point Sasa C
Think were fucked this season .Just got such a bad feeling .Was so upbeat with all our new players but it just aint working.Still have a losing mentality.
I agree. Clarke is future. Lescott is cover.